Suggested by Random Asriel may be one of those fighters who puts the fear in you, but he won’t be able to handle someone like Tatsumi. Tatsumi is a whole lot faster and stronger as well. A few good hits would definitely be enough to decide the match and Asriel certainly couldn’t hope to dodge. He will just be another one of Tatsumi’s victims in the end. If only he had gotten a power up. Tatsumi wins.
While i actually do want tatsumi to win this, sadly asriel could actually kill him and pretty easily,
at best tatsumi is like continent level while asriel can erase timelines.
while asriel’s feats are VERY unknown, its safe to say he wont be struggling agiants tatsumi anytime soon
If you check asriel’s stats in the game his attack and defense are fucking infinite, not to mention that you cant even hurt asriel. while its most likely that tatsumi is faster, i dont know how speed is gonna be a factor when your opponent has infinite defense and is invisinsible, sure tatsumi has invisibility too but it has a time limit while asriel is legit invisible forever. and then theirs the hyper goner which can erase the timeline all together or legit any attack tatsumi attempts to inflict.
Not to mention asriel’s second form which is even stronger.
Now i know this sounds outlandish and lazy and you think im underestimating tatsumi,
but im fr being serious that this was how powerful asriel was in the final boss fight, he only lost cause the protagonist frisk has shit amounts of determination to keep frisk alive. hell you have to actually break asriel mentally to even stop him from attacking and killing you.
So overall sadly asriel legit beats the shit out of tatsumi with barely any difficulty, which brings me the question why pit someone who is not even planetary level agiants a god?
I get what you’re saying but you’re overestimating the Undertale verse. It’s quite low tier with no fighter being even city level there. Infinite attack and defense within the gameplay mechanics is nothing to sneeze at but it’s also nothing for Tatsumi to fear here. Asriel has some interesting attacks and ends up being a surprisingly fun boss but has no speed or attack feats to suggest that he could handle Tatsumi.
Tatsumi has better speed and strength feats at his disposal. This is one god whose feats don’t end up matching up to the overall rank of a god. It would be a one sided fight but in Tatsumi’s favor.
well yes the undertale universe is low tier, but really the only characters that are op are omega flowey, asriel and i guess chara.
Chara cause chara’s save files can legit drag out a fight until he wins.
omega flowey is the same but to a bigger scale
and asriel is both of them but even a bigger scale.
First off why should asriel care about not being faster then tatsumi when tatsumi has no way of hurting asriel at all, cause legit asriel really cant take damage. even if he is stronger and faster, whats the point if your opponent legit cant get hurt and can erase a timeline instantly.
Asriel can be hurt though and doesn’t have any powerful attacks to stop Tatsumi. The whole save file thing is an interesting 4th wall break but it won’t really help in a fight. Flowey has some good energy blasts but for the most part their combat feats are low. Tatsumi should just be able to go in and land a solid gut punch on Asriel. There’s not a whole lot that Asriel would be able to do against that. Asriel isn’t fast enough to dodge or land any counter blows. This would just be a punching combo to the end
Forgot this was here,
But anyway where is the proof of asriel being hurt in that form during the pacifist route. asriel has many ways to kill tatsumi
1 use the hyper goner, which is a giant goat skull that can erase an entire timeline
2 asriel’s chaos sabers are far more stronger then tatsumi’s average sword
3 asriel has ranged attacks like star blazing where he rains down stars at you while exploding into tiny stars, shocker breaker which can summon lightning to the ground, fire magic, and chaos buster which can fire magical bullets at the opponent as well as a rainbow laser.
4 asriel has control over existence, he is capable of destroying whole universes with just a fraction of his power. as well as be able to reset timelines. he’s invincible and overall practically unbeatable in terms of power,
while his speed is unknown as well as strength, things like that wont matter agiants someone who can erase timelines, destroy universes and is invincible
The tricky thing with Undertale is separating the feats from the gameplay mechanics. I won’t deny that Asriel has a cool design and some nifty abilities but he won’t be moving with the same speed and ability that Tatsumi has. Speed is massively important here and yet it’s hard to decipher that from Undertale’s gameplay style. At the moment what we do know is that Tatsumi is fast though and his sword packs a punch.
Without seeing Asriel have any true super durability here, there’s no way for him to win. The stars attack isn’t literal and he’s definitely not destroying any universes or timelines. That’s where the hax have to be taken into consideration and his true power level is a whole lot lower. Undertale characters are really limited in that way
asriel being invincible is not a gameplay mechanic. its a real thing. If you check his stats he has infinite attack and defense. im talking the number eight flipped to its side, thats a real thing.
Not destroying any universes or timelines?
he legit outright says he was gonna destroy the timeline before pulling out hyper goner to destroy said timeline.
hell im not even mentioning the 2nd form, the 2nd form you cant even move at all and he ends up being far stronger.
While yes undertale characters are limited with feats and most of them outside their universes are weak. asriel is one that is far from weak.
Explain how tatsumi is meant to survive hyper goner or hell even damage asriel if he is invincible?
Yeah but even that is a mechanic because nothing’s infinite. It does show that he is really strong though so I would definitely agree that he is tough. But lets say the whole timeline thing, Hyper Goner doesn’t look crazy strong. Tatsumi should be able to punch through that attack and land a solid stab. Asriel should not be able to have any trouble landing his blows with his sheer combat speed and I don’t think Asriel would be able to just shake off the stab without taking some serious damage here. Tatsumi’s showings in the anime are just better with speed and strength
IT is fiction. fiction is a story thats not real and has properties that cant be actually real. so even if infinity does not exist in the real world. in fiction, it can exist and has done so multiple times in stories wether you say it is or not.
2nd of all judging an attack by its looks is not a good way to emphasise how strong it is. looks can be deceiving. for example, people like sans, he seems like just a funny joke character, but then we see just how strong he was and how much he knew. then theres flowey, he looks innocent but in reality is one of the most evil characters in the game. there are also other examples from different video games, like kirby, kirby may seem all innocent, but in reality the dude is a multiverse ending god no cap. he fights off gods that could end universes on a daily basis.
hyper goner would just completely erase tatsumi and everything else with it.
Like i said. asriel is invincible, so why would a sword stab work? why would tatsumi’s speed and strength matter agiants an opponent who is permanently invincible.
Asriel isn’t invincible though, just think of it as enhanced durability on a high level. Is it dangerous? Yes, but is it unstoppable? No. Tatsumi’s sword is quite strong and a few good slashes should quickly be able to start draining Asriel’s health away.
Infinity just doesn’t exist whether it’s fiction or real life. The reason for this is because there is always someone stronger, faster, smarter, etc. To introduce the concept of infinity would go against this and so it cannot be done. No verse can just say that there character has no limits or is invincible because there will always be someone to surpass that figure. That’s alll that I’m saying.
I agree that going by looks isn’t 100% the way to go but it’s still the best way most of the time. Kirby is a great example, you see people throwing a lot of hype his way like being multiversal and all but then you see him having trouble with street level opponents. Why the disconnect? It’s because everyone is looking more at lore and feats than what is actually happening. I’d put Kirby more as city block level for the most part. In general I don’t have the Undertale verse too high either but they get the job done I suppose.
Asriel isn’t invincible? wheres the proof? wheres the proof of asriel not being invincible, agian you just say he is not and then dont show proof of it at all.
In fiction infinity can exist. Everyone knows that fiction is not real, so what if infinity does not exist in the real world, it can exist in the fictional world. Your parents say you can write anything you want, your teachers do as well, especially english teachers, they even say you can, hell google even says you can and i already told you this before, here’s a quote from them “So, therefore, fiction takes on fiction-esque rules itself in that it is all made up. Rules don’t exist. If an author is talented enough to write a beloved story using emojis and pig Latin, then so be it.” There are only useful tips to writing a GOOD fictional story, if the writer wants pony’s and unicorns in their story, then they can have pony’s and unicorns in their story, i cant say anything about that, and neither can you.
Kirby is a literal god, when has he actually struggled with street level opponents? never, he has always been fighting gods. And hell why even bring up kirby struggling with weaker characters, remember, everyone learns from their past mistakes and grow’s,
Are you saying kirby losing agiants a weak street level opponent means he is really weak and all his previous fights with gods are worth nothing? Of course not, everyone still is learning, saying kirby would lose cause he lost of some random enemy thats really weak is the same as saying goku should lose all his fights cause he got one shotted by raditz, or naruto should lose cause he got knocked out by his daughter, or sasuke should lose cause he lost to rock lee in that one fight.
See what im saying, you cant judge a character based on their weakest feats alone, cause remember, Most of them still train, they get stronger, they improve. you say things like superman would lose to naruto cause he lost to the tripods? then i can easily say naruto wouldlose cause of a knockout from his daughter, or the time he got owned by rock lee, or every other time sakura punches him and beats him up? dare i say such things?
I’m picking up what you’re putting down but it still doesn’t work that way. By your logic I could create a story right now and get it published with a character who is completely invincible so then he would be stronger than Goku. That doesn’t work though. Everything has limits so no matter what I write, he would be weaker than Goku.
Put it this way, no matter how good of a story teller I am, a book lead will not be stronger than Goku. I would need to get the rights to an anime and then start to top Goku that way. Even if I say my character has limitless strength and everything, it won’t be enough. Goku is too far beyond, he is the Saiyan of legend! A beast in battle, etc. There’s just no end there and that’s the same with stands and Asriel. He can’t be fully invincible because nobody is.
As for Kirby, I’m talking about every game where he gets injured by normal minions and blown around by the wind. If it was a one time thing then I’d agree with you but this is constant. Kirby just isn’t super strong like that. He never has been! It’s just the lore that makes him sound really strong and I’m trying to help you get past that. Kirby just isn’t that dude.
As for Sasuke and Naruto, they’ve grown stronger since then so it’s moot. Kirby never gets stronger or has training arcs so it’s the same guy that he was back in the first game. That’s what really hurts him in the end.
If you want to create a story where the character is invincible and stronger then goku then go the fuck ahead, i cant say shit about what you wanna write.
Goku is still a character who can lose, he is a guy who pushes past his limits to achieve higher levels of power. but non the less, he can still lose. You dont need to produce a whole fucking anime on your character making his way to the top to beat goku. Whatever you write in your story is your law, you can make him with limitless strength, go the fuck ahead, do whatever you want, make him invincible, give him super speed, give him the power to blink a multiverse out of existence, These factors can beat goku, a guy who pushes past his limits, vs a guy who has no limits, in a fight like that. only one of them has limits to give at all.
Characters in a fictional story can be invincible, its just writers dont always choose that path, there not writing a story to create the most powerful warrior in existence. there writing a story to create a fun adventure and entertainment to the reader. Yes they can make their characters invincible if they choose too. You dont have obligations to say otherwise, your not the fucking law of book writing.
Yes kirby can get hurt by these enemy’s, but has he been defeated by them? no the fuck he does not. The game over screen you see when kirby dies is not apart of the actual story. Yes sure kirby getting hurt by enemies is common, being defeated by them, it hasn’t happend. it makes sense since he can survive a Planet exploding in his face and come out without a single scratch on him. Meanwhile naruto in His SAGE OF SIX PATHS FORM WITH KURAMA CHAKRA MODE, gets owned by a fucking sword. Oh im sorry im just looking at a characters weakest performance in their time cause by YOUR logic, they should lose cause of that. Luckily kirby has a sword form so one good stab and naruto’s screwed huh? Thats what your logic tells me.
Kirby does get stronger throughout his games and lore, the enemies and bosses get stronger and stronger and stronger.
That’s the thing though, you can say something about what I write. Even if I write something like that, it doesn’t make it true. Even if I give him limitless strength, then he won’t be stronger than Goku yet. It would take a whole lot of on screen feats and showings to do it. Just putting text in doesn’t work. Otherwise anyone can do that. I may not be the law of book writing but trust me when I say that I’ve got some really serious pull there.
Kirby gets wrecked all the time. I agree that we can’t use the game overs as gameplay mechanics but the whole damage and setting is absolutely valid. Just look at the TV show. I think a lot of times we get lost in the sauce on this but Kirby just isn’t that dude. Trust me, it pains me to say this but Kirby isn’t ready for this.
As for Naruto, he’s proven time and time again why he is the Hokage of the Hidden Leaf village. Not only can he talk any villain to death but he can move with extreme speed and power. I guarantee you that you haven’t seen Kirby move as fast as Naruto. Naruto has combat feats for days and would win in an instant
Dude i cant say shit about what you wnat in your story, i can write one right now and make my character stronger, faster and overall more powerful then goku, saitama and naruto. Who is there to stop me? No one, Theres no law saying i cant do that.
On screen animation is there for more entertainment, for fun. You dont need to spend billions of money on a show to make a character stronger then goku. You can do that if you choose too. But that does not mean you have to.
Kirby in the show Just show’s how durable he is, Like fr the dude does not like have a single amount of blood on him despite all the shit he went through. When the same shit would have naruto injured. Like has naruto survived a planet sized explosion. No
Has naruto punched the ground so hard he cracks the planet in half? no, does naruto have a copy ability where the dude can just steal abilities or hell inhale his foes into his belly? no.
Yes naruto is amazing ok, i get it.
But bragging about how amazing he is is not gonna help him win. Kirby is able to pilot the warp star which moves FTL and even if he cant react to it, agian, he survived a planet sized explosion without a scratch.
Naruto is amazing but this isn’t about that. Okay put it this way, Kirby is a great fighter with amazing powers and techniques. Nobody can take that away from him but at the same time, Naruto has the better showings. He is always fighting with aliens and other supernatural monsters and does so with pure combat ability. Kirby isn’t ready for those kinds of feats and has to survive on lore for his villains. That’s not going to cut it against a man like Naruto. Kirby has taken too many losses.
Trust me, just writing it is not enough. You absolutely need some animation or at least top tier manga images to get this across. Otherwise just writing saying that someone is stronger than Goku just doesn’t work. Nobody would believe it
Aliens? supernatural monsters? My guy kirby fights universe ending gods on a daily baises now, and he come out without a scratch on him. Agian all your looking at is kirby beign hurt by enemies, how do you know he loses to them? he doesn’t, cause the story progress’s.
You dont need animation ot manga images to make a character strong, you can but you dont have too.
Yeah but those gods are really trying to live up to the hype. They aren’t nearly as strong as they appear. How else would Kirby not look all that strong all the time? He isn’t weak but he’s not super strong like that. Just look at any cutscene and it’s clear that Kirby isn’t universal
Trust me, the animation is absolutely necessary. You can only go so far with text.
They do live up to the hype, One of kirby’s strongest villans void termina, could destroy the fucking multiverse. Then we got fucking marx who shoots a laser that creates blackholes. And we got magalor, the dude can literally bend the universe to his will. Not a fucking single naruto and boruto character you would know could beat those 3.
The cutscenes in kirby keep having kirby beta up cause like i said, he is battling manaics like the 3 i mentioned like its a every day thing now.
Animation is not neccecary, sure with text you have to imagine the a fight happening but if the book cleraly states that a universe has been destroyed by a certain character, then yeah that character is universal.
The Multiverse is good but it feels like a lot of guys can break it lately. Those villains all sound good on paper but then you see them in action and they aren’t super strong like that. I’d go on record to say that Naruto could absolutely destroy any of those guys low diff. I think you’re majorly underestimating how powerful Naruto is. He’s on a completely different level in terms of power and speed. You just can’t go against him. When he activates his ninjutsu there will be nowhere to run.
As for Kirby getting beat up, I’d say it’s still important. It’s clear that’s his intended strength and not the whole multiversal stuff. That just doesn’t hold up when you consider what kind of fighter Kirby is. He just isn’t that dude.
Nah a book just saying that isn’t going to fly. You need to see it to really appreciate the feats and stakes here
Naruto would actually get destroyed as stupid and corny as it sounds. the dude is nowhere near star level in the first place so why think he could take on universe ending gods. Naruto’s rasengan’s would mean nothing agiants them, naruto cant even pull off a city level kill with them.
I can tell ya that alot of people would say kirby would win over naruto
Like just look here https://www.quora.com/Who-would-win-in-a-fight-Kirby-or-Naruto
You cant deny all this, these are other people who know what the 2 are capable of, hell one guy bumped naruto to planet destroying, tbh, thats really generous. But its still not enough.
A book can still make a story where a character is stronger then goku or kirby or whoever they want.
That does sound a bit corny man. Cmon, Naruto isn’t losing to any of these guys. He could just grab the ole Rasengan and just start spamming. Those guys are all mistaken and falling for the Kirby lore hype. They’ve forgotten that Kirby just isn’t that dude. He’s not getting the big wins in the championship or showing up in the clutch situations. Why do you think he was absolutely getting devastated throughout the Kirby TV show?
He’s not on Naruto’s level just like most book characters never make it to the next level. The deck is stacked against them and it feels bad man. It feels….badddddddd
They dont fall for the kirby lore hype. there right about it. want me to start doubting the 4th great ninja war now? naruto needed the 5 nations and a buff from legit god himself while kriby just needed himself and a couple of friends, naruto had to seal away a god thats not even star level, while kirby destroyed a universal or hell multiversal god.
In the kirby tv show he fights a god too, and defeats him.all by himself in a fight.
Yo, don’t be talking smack about my man Naruto. I don’t care how he did it, Naruto ended up beating everyone in his path. He proved once and for all that talent will always beat destiny. He’s the man with a plan and always comes out on top. As for the Kirbster, look I get it. He’s a cool character and we all want him to succeed. That’s fine but at the end of the day he’s not going to come out on top. It’s just not going to happen because he lacks the speed and raw power needed to make it all the way to the top.
If naruto needed the 5 great nations, the previous 4 hokage, and literal god himself to give himself and sasuke powers to fight agiants madara which btw even at his strongest is not even star level. There is no way he could stand up to enemies that are capable of destroying the universe or hell the multiverse.
Kirby’s warpstar can fly at FTL speeds and kirby can react fast enough to even pilot it. Meaning he can react to naruto’s attacks, even then if he gets it, he survived a planet sized explosions without a scratch. meanwhile madara, the strongest person in the war so far, got half his body destroyed by night guy, who is not even moon level.
And then theres the part where kirby could just inhale any ability naruto could throw at him. Hell kirby was able to crack his planet in half just by punching the ground.
Hell kirby threw a giant frying pan with a monster on it into fucking orbit to the sun and back. NOT A SINGLE NARUTO CHARACTER HAS DISPLAYED THAT MUCH STRENGTH BEFORE.
Naruto didn’t need those guys much though. The hokages didn’t help much at all and the nations were fodder for the most part. Don’t get it twisted, Naruto is that guy. He could stand up to any villain who tries to defy him. Kirby’s warpstar isn’t ready for combat speed. It can travel around but in a fight Naruto is going to outmanuever that guy from day 1. There’s no escape from his incredible ninjutsu and taijutsu.
Kirby isn’t fast enough to keep up even if he can see Naruto coming and swallowing him would be a bad idea since Naruto could hit him from inside. That would be the ultimate game over moment.
Didn’t help him much, My guy naruto would have been dead if it was not for the 5 nations.
When naruto got the tailed beast ripped out of him, he needed sakura and gaara’s help to keep him alive, then have the other half of kurama sealed inside him, which was doen by a trying minato and then obito, and then is gifted fucking powers from hagaromo.
Hell the 5 great nations, the hokage’s and naruto struggled againts juubito, with juubito only losing cause plot and a change of heart. they even struggled with the ten tails alone, and naruto had killer bee the 5 greta nations legit so many people helping.
Now imagine that but its just naruto, fucking dead.
If it travels FTL and kirby can pilot it FTL, then kirby’s reaction should be FTL even if its not, agian, kirby survived a planet explosion, a fucking black hole.
and no if kirby swallows him naruto could not destroy kirby from the inside, kirby’s stomach is a legit seperate diemension, we find this out in the kirby tv show, though i highly doubt you watched it.
Naruto would have to legit destroy a entire dimension. not happening.
Yeah Naruto would have died a few times but at the end of the day he knew they were there so that affected how he fought. If he knew that he was truly alone then he would have used a lot more tactics. Probably still would have died but no shame in dying against one of the strongest opposing armies in history. Sometimes there just isn’t a whole lot that you can do against an impressive force like this. You just have to hold the L and hope for the best. It’s all any of us can do really.
I wouldn’t agree with that. Plenty of people pilot trains that are supersonic or jets that are hypersonic but we don’t give them those kinds of reaction times. Piloting is just that…piloting. The speed is different because of physics. As for the Kirby stomach dimension, yeah I’ve kind of seen that too in theory but you can still bust out of there. Think of it as more of an abstract dimension. Naruto just needs to focus his chakra and use one of his Bijuu bombs to get out
Alot more tactics would not have helped, agiants juubito, he would be screwed, that tailed beast bomb cage attack that obito was about to send out would have killed naruto, the allied shinobi forces only were able to survive cause they ha dthe help of both naruto and minato to teleport them out, naruto never knew the flying raijin jutsu and even then would not have the seal ready to do so. even when naruto was fighting juubito with sasuke they coudl not even beat him, why would naruto alone do better?
If that was kirby, the dude would have probably swallowed all the tailed beast bombs. or hell, use the star rod agiants obito and madara, cause the star rod is really good when destroying evil forces.
The difference is that pilots are not fucking moving FTL. Hell they probably would die doing that.
Kirby’s stomach diemension is just that, a diemension. its not an abstract one, cause people could interact with it, besides its how kriby can activate alot of his powers. Hell with the hypernova fruit, its gg’s, In that form kirby’s inhale ability is just blown off the charts.
I agree that the Tailed Beast Bomb cage is absolutely insane. Tactics would have been tough but maybe he could have dodged in time or used a ninjutsu to break the cage before it was formed. Not saying Naruto would definitely win, but we’ve seen him beat the odds time and time again. With enough dedication and conviction to the cause, there is no opponent that Naruto can’t defeat. He is that dude and would absolutely keep on fighting all the way to the end. Nobody’s taking him down!
As for Kirby, I think he wouldn’t have the space for that many beasts. They would just be too much for him and my pilot logic is still sound because they aren’t supersonic either. It’s pilot mechanics that affect the feats even in the real world.
Dodged a tailed beast bomb thats in a cage, a cage thats more stronger then the hokages cage. and at the time both hashirama and minato were stronger then naruto. No way would naruto be able to dodge nor break the cage.
Dedication and determination cannot always give you the win.
Enough space? kirby’s stomach is a whole new fucking dimension, with the hypernova fruit, he would have swallowed all of that shit whole. Even then he would have survived the blast, cause like i said, he survived a planet sized explosion without a scratch, while the tailed beats bombs were only capable of destroying mountains, not even close to moon level.
It snot pilot mechanics, its the fact that the pilots dont travel faster then light. Thats why there reaction speeds arent as high, cause there not trying to pilot a fucking star that travels FTL.
Naruto can break the cage I’d say because he was stronger than Minato. Hashirama is more debatable but in terms of pure power? It’s hard to go higher than Naruto.
As for Kirby’s dimension, dimension busting isn’t all that crazy if you focus your power. Naruto should be able to do that with a tailed beast bomb or just slowly suck Kirby’s life force away in Baryon Mode. Kirby’s not walking away from that kind of fight because Naruto just scales higher in combat.
As for the pilots, I’m still saying that their reactions don’t scale to the speed of the vehicle. That’s all and it makes sense
Naruto at the time was not stronger then minato.
Minato was faster and had more expirence and has similar ability’s to Naruto himself.
Hashirama at the time would beat Naruto.
The wood golem jutsu could take on madara’s susanoo. And he’ll the wood golden was the very thing that suppressed the nine tails’s chakra.
Hell in madara and hashirama’s final battle.
Madara legit had his Susanoo wrapped around kurama himself. And the wood golden supressed the nine tails chakra with ease. No way would Naruto be able to take on hashirama.
You can’t just destroy anything in your path by focusing your power. Since when has Naruto even destroyed a diemension or hell a planet before?
From what I researched kirby actually has a HUGE life span. Cause apparently their species has Huge ass life spans that last them century’s. Even then baryon mode does not last very long. Hell it’s life span power did not really do much agiants isshiki.
From what we see baryon mode lasts 30 minutes and in the battle against isshiki, Naruto got isshiki’s lifespan down from 20 hours to 10 minutes.
Not bad and pretty dangerous but then again.
Isshiki did not even have a day to live.
And considering how Kirby has century’s to live. Baryon mode would be a complete waste and a huge sacrifice to Naruto, and would put him at a big disadvantage once his 30 minutes are up.
The speed of a vehicle does not scale to a fucking jet or plane.
Minato’s abilities were similar but he wasn’t a power type the way that Naruto was. It felt like Naruto could have crushed him with a powerful jutsu at any point and Minato would not have been able to stop him. Especially since the speed was equalized at that point. For Hashirama, I see Naruto winning with pure speed. He could be trapped as you mentioned, but I don’t think that Hashirama would be fast enough to get Naruto like that. Not if it was a 1 on 1 fight at least.
Naruto’s best destruction feat is less than a planet but he’s never had to destroy a dimension before. He should be able to pull this off as long as he focuses up and Kirby’s durability is a little more untested. Kirby probably wouldn’t even know that his life is being drained and that’s what will hurt him. Especially since Kirby can’t fight back, Naruto will just keep absorbing him and replenishing his own power.
The speed doesn’t scale but it’s the same concept. Piloting something doesn’t give you reaction times.
It was stated throughout the story that minato was still stronger with kcm. if minato without kcm could stop a tailed beast bomb, the naruto would not be any different.
Naruto winning with speed is unlikely, while he cant move as fast as naruto his reaction time makes up for it, besides he is far more experienced, had a much more destructive arsenal, and hell even naruto was stopped by yamato with wood. wood jutsu’s have been capable of supressing chakra, and hell hashirama could keep up with madara, who do I really need to explain why that’s impressive? The moment naruto is grabbed he is finished. hell hashirama could have just summoned His wood release true several thousand hand jutsu to obliterate naruto, it was able to beat kurama covered in madara’s susanoo, so I don’t think a kurama chakra avatar is gonna survive either.
Hell its even stated that naruto almost had as much chakra as hashirama, key word being ALMOST, so hashirama still had more chakra to spare.
If naruto cant even destroy a entire planet, why the hell would you think he could destroy a diemension.
And when has baryon mode been shown to absorb and replenish his energy, ist the complete opposite, its actually draining his energy by just using baryon mode.
And I already said how kirby has survived a planetary destruction blast. Naruto’s 30 minutes in baryon mode would be a waste.
Pilioting something gives you better reaction times if you move fast enough while weaving between a lot of obstacles.
Kirby’s warp star moves FTL and there has been times where he had to constantly weave around enemey’s.
Minato didn’t look super impressive in the final war though. He was getting his limbs shot off as if he wasn’t even moving. Meanwhile Naruto didn’t take any lethal hits like that and was dishing out the damage. It’s hard to see Minato doing all of that.
Now I agree that if Naruto is grabbed then he could be finished, but Naruto is so fast and resourceful that it would be extremely difficult to pin him down. I’m not sure if Hashirama really has that much energy left within him or if he would just go down. It would be interesting though.
So for the dimensions, I find that it’s not always as strong as a planet. Just focus on an area to rip a hole in the dimension and you’re all set. So technically that’s all that Naruto has to do and then he would be out of Kirby’s headspace. It should definitely be feasible for him to pull this off. As for Baryon, I was thinking he would just hold onto Kirby’s life energy as he drains it and add on to his own.
Kirby’s travel speed is really good so I can buy into the FTL part but it won’t help in combat speed. There’s nothing he would be able to do against a guy like Naruto and without the star I’d say that Kirby isn’t even supersonic.
Minato was legit being bodied by juubito, fucking juubito. as well as juubi madara, naruto on his own could not defeat them.
No lethal hits? Naruto legit died when his tailed beast got extracted.
Besides his limbs would have gotten torn off too if he was hit by the truth seeking balls.
Hell when the ten tails was rampaging he was wounded and needed sakura to recover his strength.
Hashirama can keep up with madara in a fight. and we know danm well madara at the time would wipe the floor with naruto. Besides hashirama is a more smart fighter then naruto with more experience.
Now of course naruto did surpass hashirama when he was given so6p.
But again it was gifted by hagaromo for when he died.
Even then, naruto was given only the yang half. while juubito and juubimadara had the yin yang and yin-yang paths
How the hell would naruto be capable of ripping a hole through space and reality?
For one he has never done that, your just assuming he can, The only people who have been capable of ripping holes into different dimensions are those with rinnegan and the karma ability. Naruto has neither of those.
Even then, the diemension is STILL kirby’s stomach.
Kirby can actually control what he stores in his stomach and what is completely destroyed.
After digging kirby’s stomach diemensionis called the copy palette, where he stores all his food and stuff. He can choose to either use whatever is in their for battle or combine stuff to create new things, dude’s got an entire lab in their.
But like i said he could also choose what to destroy. So if naruto is inhaled and enters his stomach, then well kirby could just, completely destroy naruto.
Or hell gain his ability’s.
Who knows.
Baryon mode does not work like that, naruto only drains the life energy off of something,not gain it for himself.
Besides not that it would matter cause once the 30 minutes are up naruto would have lost kurama and his great strength speed durability and regeneration ability’s as well as his unholy amounts of chakra.
Why would you suspect naruto in baryon mode could take out kirby who has bundles of years left to live, when he cant even last 30 minutes, and in those 30 minutes he can’t even get a guy who does not even have a day to live down enough till he dies.
With kirby’s warp star he could simply speedblitz naruto and just fire from a distant.
even then i did mention the whole, kirby survived a planet explosion thing
Minato was getting bodied, I definitely agree with that but he’s just not ready to hang with the big guns like Naruto was. He still has the speed advantage though so if I was putting him up against the 1st Hokage then it should be a big win in his favor. Speed is always the best factor to have in a fight after all.
Now for Baryon Naruto, it’s important to note that his speed and power are incredible! Isshiki was still landing blows and stuff to weaken him but Kirby wouldn’t have any of that. Naruto should be able to just completely dismantle this guy in combat and I say that as a very casual Kirby fan. Kirby may have some decent moves but he’s way too slow and has trouble with street level fighters. That’s the big difference between him and a guy like Naruto. It’s hard to get around that.
I think we’re overrating Kirby a bit here. If he was so tough then why would he be having so much trouble in Dreamland? It doesn’t make any sense so I just have to push back on that one. #NotMyKirby Kirby is a good fighter but the realm of Nintendo can rarely hold its own against true anime fighters. It’s just not happening.
Speed does not instantly mean you win. Even if hashirama is likely slower, would naruto be capable of actually putting him down with his strength? Even then could naruto keep up with dodging hashirama’s wood style absorption?
Likely not.
Hashirama could battle against madara who naruto did not even stand a chance against at the time.
The problem is that your looking at kirby from some random point in his adventure. Last time I checked, i don’t think gods that create blackholes and are strong enough to destroy multiverses are street level.
Can naruto punch with the power of a planet? No, even then kirby would survive.
Naruto has been shown numerous times on how much he gets hurt while kirby has not even bled or shown a scratch on him once.
Kirby’s dreamland is SUPER old, that’s kirby WAY back in the past, even then kirby in dreamland already fought a god anyway.
Remember, we both trying to look at these characters in at their best, not their worst, but then you mention kirby when he was starting out.
You don’t see me mentioning kid naruto feats.
I’d say yes, Naruto’s attacks would really dish out a lot of damage. It’s why speed is so important. So long as you can hurt your opponent then having the speed advantage will always result in a win. It’s only when you can’t hurt someone that speed starts to get in your way instead. That gap isn’t quite so crazy here though. So that’s why Naruto should be able to win here.
It’s not about mentioning Kirby’s older feats but that it still applies to the newest one. Have you played the latest Switch game? He still has trouble with everyone and barely seems to be city block level. There’s no way he’s tanking Naruto’s hits. The gameplay mechanics make Kirby seem really powerful but at the end of the day he’s just a dude and nobody can take down Naruto like that. His abilities are much too fierce!
Dude it takes just one slip up for naruto to be caught by hashirama’s wood style ability’s, plus even if naruto was faster, hashirama at the time was stronger and had more experience then naruto. Hashirama would no doubt be able to catch naruto even if he was faster.
Dude kirby being hurt by the enemy’s in a stage is a gameplay mechanic.
Of course he manages to instantly win against them no sweat.
Agian bro, taking kirby’s planet explosion feat out of context wont help, considering how he also scales to king dedede, who survived being sucked into a black hole.
Naruto is not surviving.
Even then kirby could just absorb all of naruto’s power and gain his ability’s for his own.
There won’t be a slip up though and Naruto would have won by then. Naruto’s raw strength is just way too incredible. All will fall before his mighty abilities and a massive giant Rasengan would end things real quick too. Hashirama doesn’t have the same level of combat experience on his side which is what will hurt him quite massively here. He would have needed some really good techniques and all to win but he doesn’t have those. The wood isn’t enough.
As for Kirby, he is still not one of the most powerful fighters. He regularly has trouble with normal opponents and his higher end feats tend to involve toon force and a bit of luck. Naruto would absolutely crush him in a fight due to the speed difference and change in power levels.
There wont be a slip up?, Naruto has had many slip up’s, like when he forgotto use sage jutsu to even hurt juubito, and needed tobirama to remind him. and hell NARUTO WAS THE ONE WHO THOUGHT OF IT IN THE FIRST PLACE. even tobirama said he was more dumber then hashirama.
If hashirama’s wood golem could stand up to madara’s susanoo, then it would be able to stand up against a chakra tailed beast form. after all that’s what hashirama did fight.
Hashirama has far more combat experience on his side then naruto, dude fought in wars when he was still young.
The wood would drain naruto’s chakra or completely dispell any attempts of hurting hashirama.
When the fuck has toon force been stated in kirby, You dont even know what your talking about, you do 0 research.
You keep forgetting that its a game mechanic. of course kirby stomps all the normal opponents.
Afterall, at least kirby did more of his journeys on his own. While I ended up listing a whole fuckign list of times naruto needed help in isshiki vs darkseid.
Naruto slips up sometimes when he’s having fun but in a full fight that’s not happening. Naruto is combat ready and that’s where his true genius shines. Just give him a few minutes to really get going and he’ll show you combos for days. This guy doesn’t let up and never slows down. Naruto would be able to crush the golem and keep on going. Hashirama’s only chance is if Naruto messes up and doesn’t dodge a hit but that doesn’t seem very likely. I don’t think it would happen at least.
It can’t be a mechanic though because this is the case for Kirby in the cutscenes and the anime as well. He’s just not that dude. Kirby is powerful I’ll give you that but he’s not this big planet buster that everyone thinks he is. He’s a fun Nintendo mascot who is stronger than he looks but that’s about it. He’s still getting rocked by all the big fighters.
I fr hoping your not talking about hokage naruto for this one cause I’m referring to naruto during the juubito fight. or before he got access to so6p
Hokage naruto can and will beat hashirama
but the version of naruto before so6p, hell naw.
Hashirama was a far more experienced fighter and even if faster, could still figure out naruto’s speed, after all, he has sage mode too.
The time kirby gets shit on in cutscenes are by literal gods, and the anime, is not canon. sorry dude.
Why look at kirby’s feats low feats and say he wont do well? again there not really meant to happen and are just there for entertainment purposes of gameplay.
Yeah Naruto during Juubito would absolutely crush Hashirama. Experience doesn’t mean as much when your stats are so much lower. He would spend most of the fight getting absolutely devastated by Naruto with no real way to make a comeback. That is what really hurts him here. It’s that he just wouldn’t be able to jump in there and make a difference, not so easily at least.
It’s not about looking for Kirby’s low feats but seeing that he’s consistently not portrayed to be super strong so it makes everything else feel a bit dubious. Perhaps he isn’t nearly as strong as he wants us to think he is? It would add a whole lot of depth to the Kirby mythos and I for one am quite nervous about that. It’s hard to see Kirby taking on any of the big threats.
The problem is people downplay expirence far too much in combat, even then why did you assume naruto’s stats were better, naruto
Does not have as much chakra as hashirama
does not have more experience
does not have the arsenal to stand up to hashirama
does not have the power needed.
does not have the durability needed.
Agian hashirama has already fought kurama with susanoo armour that was guided by madara, why would naruto be different? in fact, its probably weaker. Besides his 1000 arm wood thing that he used against kurama cloaked susanoo absolutely devastated it. no sweat would it be able to destroy naruto’s kurama cloak.
Agian dude, just cause he has some random point in his timeline where he has had a falling, does not mean it fully effects his full power, even then, at least he did most of his feats on his own. Unlike naruto
Naruto is a better all around fighter. Hashirama is older and doesn’t have as much stamina. His jutsu are more uninspired and he doesn’t have Naruto’s will to win. Naruto should be able to easily clobber Hashirama due to his speed and his overall abilities. Hashirama would be on the back foot right from the start and I don’t see him making a comeback. It really boils down to the fact that Naruto can fight even without Kurama so together they are just too powerful. Naruto may have needed help but in the end his feats were always in a league of their own. Isn’t that what matters?
Just cause hashirama has lived longer does not mean his stamina lacks compared to naruto. Doesn’t have naruto’s will, dude had to kill off his best friend in order to protect the leaf village from danger, dude had to fight through wars since his childhood. I’m pretty sure he too is just as willful as naruto.
Naruto’s speed wont matter, speed cant always win you a fight, especially if the other guy could suck and suppress all your chakra with their jutsu.
If hashirama is a guy who can fight madara’s susanoo for several days and end up being the victor in the end, and then fight him again when he is stronger, then why the hell is naruto going to succeed with his current state, yes right now naruto with so6p beats hashirama but I’m trying to discuss naruto when he was fighting juubito.
Naruto could have done all of that in spades. Hashirama did real good so I don’t want to take that away from him but there’s a reason why the series is called Naruto and not Hashirama. Naruto even at that point during the Juubito fight was more than a match for Hashirama and would have defeated him in short order. The clones aren’t fast enough and no trees are going to grab Naruto. He would be running around past the speed of sound and just landing devastating blows throughout
Dude no shit naruto surpasses hashirama by the end of the series, I’m saying that hashirama during the war arc was still stronger then naruto during the juubito arc.
No tree’s catching naruto, naruto and his friends legit almost die by the divine tree sucking out their chakra.
Hell hashirama was able to dodge every vine from the divine tree, while naruto got caught and almost died but thanks to hiruzen, was saved.
And in case your wondering yes naruto was trying to out pace the vines but still got caught anyway
I follow you but Naruto solos Hashirama even during the Juubito arc. He was a lot faster and stronger at this point in time. The vines would not be enough to stop him, no shot! Naruto would just keep on running. I won’t deny that he got caught once but he was trying to protect everyone and got distracted. In a one on one fight that never would have happened because Naruto is That dude. He would have kept on fighting right up through to the end and Hashirama would not be able to hit him.
Proof of naruto being stronger then hashirama?
Got distracted? dude was caught cause he could not outspeed it.
And then there’s hashirama, jumping from vine to vine dodging every single one while speaking with madara.
That chakra drain, is exactly what would happen once hashirama hits him with the seal.
Hell, this is the very same dude who nullified kurama’s chakra with his wood golem.
Proof? Naruto beat up Madara, Kaguya, Isshiki, and Jigen. Even if this is just Naruto at this point in the manga, he was already faster and stronger than Hashirama. The guy died for a reason while Naruto was still cooking. There is not a Kage alive or dead who can match Naruto’s power. Naruto does struggle quite a lot during the fights but that’s because he is always going up against the absolute strongest fighters across the cosmos. If you put him up against anyone even slightly weaker than that then it’s all over. That would be the end of the match in an instant. I didn’t want to say it but it just be like that.
You did put up some very convincing links but those wood abilities are all limited while Naruto can just move freely on his own. Mix in his impressive strength and that would be the end of the match.
Your actually stupid, we are talking about the naruto during the juubito fight, naruto at the time was no where close to madara, kaguya isshiki or jigen. and hell, all 4 battles you mentioned, naruto needed help.
dude if madara, someone at the time who was more experienced and more powerful then naruto, lost to hashirama, hashirama wont have trouble beating naruto during juubito arc, especially with his new gates that he would use to fuckigng hold down the ten tails.
I know we’re talking about the Juubito fight but Naruto would still be clobbering everyone. Sure he would have lost to Jigen and Isshiki but he could take Kaguya with the speedblitz. Hashirama just isn’t handling a speed fighter like that.
Honestly I don’t even know why Madara had so much trouble with him. Hashirama’s plants are good but without pure speed to back you up it’ll never be enough. All he can do is play defense but eventually Naruto is going in for the win and he’s going to be Mad! That’s not an opponent you really want to have to deal with.
Speedblizt kaguya?
Even when naruto had so6p he still could not speedblitz or even beat kaguya, and he even had help with fucking rinnegan sasuke, sakura and kakashi abd obito.
What makes you think naruto during the juubito fight could stand a chance?
Madara had trouble because hahsirama was far too strong, speed does not mean everything. and plus if hashirama could keep up with madara, but naruto cant keep up with madara until he got so6p. then no naruto cant. plus speedblizting requires not only speed but strength too. you need to be strong enough to even hurt the attacker.
And plus that’s almost impossible since hashirama at the time was a reanimation, but even if he was not, hashirama can still react fast enough or even be able to grab naruto once with his better expirence.
Kaguya is tough but she’s not quite fast enough to really keep up with Naruto. He could definitely speedblitz her at this point and it’s something he should have tried a lot more during their fight. I think he was overwhelmed by her overall ability but it’s fair to say that in normal circumstances she would not be able to do a whole lot against him. Naruto is just way too powerful, he is That guy! It’s what makes him such an intense fighter.
I trust in Naruto’s hand to hand and combat speed enough where I think he would be able to dominate the fight, even when it was the him during the Juubito fight. Madara and Naruto should still be able to take Hashirama down pretty quick. His plants just aren’t strong enough to survive their combined assault. It’s why they are known as such legendary fighters. They go in hard! They have more skills than most opponents would even dream of. It’s what makes them impressive fighters. Hashirama is more of a one trick pony with the plants and summoning.
He is still super strong absolutely but not strong enough
Kaguya is far stronger then naruto even when naruto was a adult. In this time period it would take naruto and sasuke to beat kaguya, but not kill her.
In the fight, naruto could not speedblitz kaguya,because trying to speedblitz someone with a Rinne Sharingan and byakugan is pretty much setting yourself up for a smack in the face. plus, naruto could not really damage her anyway, even when he had like several tailed beast rasen shurikens from the many different tailed beasts, he only caused minor damage to him. Plus Amaterasu from sasuke was harmless too.
In the juubito fight, madara was stronger then hashirama, but hashirama was still stronger then naruto at the time. Madara was stronger thanks to his new rinnegan and wood style jutsu abilities and extra buffs he got from kabuto.
Also, your combining naruto and madara’s power? the hell you on?
No shit they win.
But naruto on his own wont.
Hashirama with his wood style jutsu can pretty much create many different possibilities. Both madara and hashirama displayed such abilities before that put the 5 kage to shame.
I dunno about Kaguya being stronger than Naruto as an adult. I see Naruto being able to beat her 1 on 1 because Kaguya only had a slight edge when they were teens. Once his stats are above hers then it should be a straight shot to getting the W. She would have a hard time keeping up with him and the whole dimension shifting was a bit erratic so she wouldn’t want to rely on that for too long.
Madara’s abilities were always more impressive than Hashirama’s though, even in base. The Sharingan was just so broken and physically they were already on the same level too so the visual jutsu just puts him in a different level. That said, I do agree that both of them are way above the 5 Kage who are really disgraceful.
No, he cant, every otsutsuki member naruto has fought he always had sasuke to back him up,though with urashiki im sure naruto can win, but otutsuki members like momoshiki, kaguya, isshiki, possibly kinshiki, he needed help from sasuke.
Im not saying hahsirama can beat madara with rinnegan and wood style, im saying hashirama was still better wat wood style then madara, but thanks to the added buff of the sharingan and rinnegan, madara had the edge.
But naruto would fall to both of these guys, After all naruto with his kurama chakra mode avatar was instantly restrained by a wood dragon. Because wood can suppress the tailed beast powers. and naruto needed help to even escape.
Naruto during the juubito arc just could not beat hashirama, when naruto gains so6p though, then yes naruto shits on hashirama
Sure I can agree that Hashirama was specifically better than Madara at wood style. It was his specialty so for sure that seems reasonable. That said, Naruto would still crush Hashirama quickly if he was serious. His clones would take care of the wood dragons while he just takes him out in hand to hand. His strength and overall power level are just way too high for anything less than that. He would be able to just go in and take names that way. It’s why I’d also say Naruto can beat the aliens because he has the shadow clones at the ready. I think he didn’t use them enough in the series tbh
Absolutely not naruto’s clones would have their chakra suppressed by the wood dragons.
Why?
Because naruto’s shadow clones don’t support enough chakra needed to sustain themselves in long term fights, besides whats stopping hashirama from just making more?
Even then hashirama has wood clones too which could match that of naruto’s shadow clones.
And like i said, the 100arm buddha thing outsized kurama, so its safe to say naruto is going to die by that
Yes naruto has overpowered wood style jutsu before, but only against weaker wood styles, yamato’s madara’s etc, but hashirama? No
He would need so6p to beat hashirama by then.
and also what aliens?
are you referring to the otsutsuki’s
If so then he still needed so6p to contend with them.
And no not counting juubito
Juubito lost because of the fact that he had lost the will to fight, that as well as that naruto needed sasuke along with the rest fo the allied shinobi forces to help.
and for a bonus
its not that naruto did not use them enough.
Its because he cant always spam millions of clones whenever he feels like it
He still has limited chakra, sure he has a absurd amount of it but still limited, especially since he has other techniques besides shadow clone spam.
that’s why by the near end of the series , he only summons 2 to 3 clones during hand to hand fights or summons a thousand of them for distractions or to counter against an army.
Yeah Naruto can be suppressed but at the end of the day he will still win. I think we are heavily overestimating the amount of power that Hashirama has. There is a good reason why he is always hiding behind the trees and that’s because he just can’t keep up in terms of hand to hand skills or overall talent and ability. Naruto would absolutely decimate him in a fair fight and that’s why the guy wouldn’t want to go up against him.
Juubito did lose the will to fight so I can agree with that. That said, Naruto can definitely spam millions of clones if he wants too. The only reason he didn’t do this is because at the time he was just completely overwhelmed with fighting so many opponents. In a one on one fight at full power I absolutely do think he could spam a few million without breaking a sweat. It’s not something that would be so impossible for him to manage at all. Honestly it should be an easy feat at this point.
He still has the better techniques and speed at his side so that should result in a really quick win imo
we are not, if anything you underestimate every hokage besides naruto.
Hashirama could keep up with madara in like every category besides arsenal and maybe strength. And madara was the guy who could deal with sage mode naruto, gaara, onoki, and a whole shinobi army. then the 5 kage and the tailed beasts. and hashirama was the only person that madara wanted to fight at the time, during their battle in the 4th shinobi war, he was the only person there that could deal with madara’s susanoo.
Naruto cannot spam millions of clones, the most clones we have seen him use at once is like about 5000, and even then that’s only in naruto ultimate ninja storm 4 by naruto (the last) ultimate move, which btw ain’t canon.
but even then hashirama’s true several thousand hands could easily wipe out the clones and the kurama avatar, after all its bigger then the kurama avatar that naruto can make.
We are completely off topic about what the actual debate is about because you dragged about infinity not being real, forcing kirby to come up and then somehow naruto got into the mix.
The whole point was to prove who would win, asriel or tatsumi.
And asriel, with his feats could easily kill off tatsumi.
Naruto easily clears all of the other Hokages though and it makes sense because he is the child of legend. The embodiment of Indra and the other original heroes who were so good. Naruto has been through more than most characters can ever achieve and he didn’t do that through hard work and dedication but through passion and talent. Madara clears Hashirama easily but for some reason they were billed as rivals within the show anyway. I never quite understood why so don’t ask me but that’s just how it is. It goes hard either way and I do want to say that Hashirama is still strong. He’s just not on the same level as someone like Naruto. No way….no how!
Yeah this did go off tangent. I say Tatsumi wins this one though. We overestimate Undertale as a verse in general. Asriel has a lot of interesting meta abilities in the game but the fighters aren’t all that strong. Tatsumi is still faster and stronger which is what counts.
Naruto as an adult or with so6p yes can beat all the other 6 hokages of course not without some level of difficulty. But i ain’t talking about so6p or adult naruto, its kcm 2 sage mode naruto that I’m talking about.
Your also apparently stupid because naruto is not the incarnation of indra, he is the incarnation of ashura.
The reason why madara could beat hashirama during the 4th great shinobi war was because madara was much stronger then hashirama when they fought, not to mention that madara had gained wood style jutsu and the rinnegan along with his eternal mangekyo sharingan. And even then he was still struggling to beat hashirama at the time, I’m not saying hashirama could have won, he would not, but hashirama was close to madara’s level.
But back in their prime days it was just madara with eternal mangekyo vs hashirama with his wood style, and when madara returned with a kurama cloaked susanoo, hashirama had fought back with his true several thousand hands, which he never used in the war arc.
Tatsumi still cant win against asriel.
Yes literally 97$ of the undertake cast are weak and tatsumi could easily dispose of them, but the remaining 3 being the human,omega flowey and asriel are battles he ain’t winning.
Because all 3 of them posses the power to reset, or destroy a timeline.
For one, asriel like i had already said has infinite stats. Making every attempt to kill him useless
and asriel has hyper goner which could eat infinite timelines.
and in case your wondering, 1 timeline=1 universe
Tatsumi has not shown anything on the scale of universal destruction.
KCM 2 Sage Mode Naruto solos all the Kages. I mix up Indra and Ashura tbh but they’re basically the same character. The reason I don’t take Hashirama seriously is because he doesn’t have the Sharingan or any kind of visual jutsu that could even the scales. There is just no way for him to stack up against Madara even briefly, let alone Naruto. Wood style just isn’t that impressive so I always have to give him the L there.
Destroying timelines and resetting things are not going to do much against Tatsumi. It only worked in game due to gameplay mechanics since the guy was basically trapped in a video game sort of like SAO. In terms of combat feats Asriel doesn’t really have much to go with. There is no path to victory here because Tatsumi has strong fundamentals and a good amount of speed and strength.
No, he can’t sure he could beat tsunade, hiruzen and maybe tobirama, and minato with kcm2 is debatale, but hashirama is someone he is not beating at the time
What do you mean wood style isn’t impressive? It is by far one of the strongest nature transformations in naruto besides yin-yang release.
it’s already proven it’s worth when characters like madara and danzo had gone through so much trouble just to get hashirama’s cells into them so they could use wood style. And the fact that hashirama had contained and captured the tailed beasts before proves this even more. Wood style is highly versatile and it’s ability to just absorb chakra and its destructive techniques are what make it extremely dangerous. Even low level wood style user’s like yamato had been praised about his wood style techniques. There’s a reason why during the battle between hashirama and madara, hashirama had won twice, it’s only when madara gained the rinnegan and wood style himself was when he could easily overpower hashirama.
Why are you comparing Undertale to SAO? That’s not how the undertale verse works, Yes the undertale franchise is a video game but that doesn’t make it a game in it’s own verse. Undertale is not a Vr game like SAO.
By that logic, Mario’s feats were fake because he’s a video game.
What gameplay mechanics? Asriel not being hurt during the battle? Even if you argue the human not being able to harm asriel was a gameplay mechanic, his defense stat says infinite which is already proof enough to the point where someone like tatsumi would be unable to harm him.
Asirel even states that he can indeed reset timelines and even destroy them during the fight with the human, the only reason he couldn’t was because both him and the human’s determination matched each other.
And he stated this when he was only using a fraction of his power.
Tatsumi has never shown anything close to what asriel can do. No akame ga kill character has.
While i actually do want tatsumi to win this, sadly asriel could actually kill him and pretty easily,
at best tatsumi is like continent level while asriel can erase timelines.
while asriel’s feats are VERY unknown, its safe to say he wont be struggling agiants tatsumi anytime soon
If you check asriel’s stats in the game his attack and defense are fucking infinite, not to mention that you cant even hurt asriel. while its most likely that tatsumi is faster, i dont know how speed is gonna be a factor when your opponent has infinite defense and is invisinsible, sure tatsumi has invisibility too but it has a time limit while asriel is legit invisible forever. and then theirs the hyper goner which can erase the timeline all together or legit any attack tatsumi attempts to inflict.
Not to mention asriel’s second form which is even stronger.
Now i know this sounds outlandish and lazy and you think im underestimating tatsumi,
but im fr being serious that this was how powerful asriel was in the final boss fight, he only lost cause the protagonist frisk has shit amounts of determination to keep frisk alive. hell you have to actually break asriel mentally to even stop him from attacking and killing you.
So overall sadly asriel legit beats the shit out of tatsumi with barely any difficulty, which brings me the question why pit someone who is not even planetary level agiants a god?
By wat on June 28, 2022 at 1:03 pm
I get what you’re saying but you’re overestimating the Undertale verse. It’s quite low tier with no fighter being even city level there. Infinite attack and defense within the gameplay mechanics is nothing to sneeze at but it’s also nothing for Tatsumi to fear here. Asriel has some interesting attacks and ends up being a surprisingly fun boss but has no speed or attack feats to suggest that he could handle Tatsumi.
Tatsumi has better speed and strength feats at his disposal. This is one god whose feats don’t end up matching up to the overall rank of a god. It would be a one sided fight but in Tatsumi’s favor.
By dreager1 on July 2, 2022 at 6:03 pm
well yes the undertale universe is low tier, but really the only characters that are op are omega flowey, asriel and i guess chara.
Chara cause chara’s save files can legit drag out a fight until he wins.
omega flowey is the same but to a bigger scale
and asriel is both of them but even a bigger scale.
First off why should asriel care about not being faster then tatsumi when tatsumi has no way of hurting asriel at all, cause legit asriel really cant take damage. even if he is stronger and faster, whats the point if your opponent legit cant get hurt and can erase a timeline instantly.
By wat on July 2, 2022 at 9:51 pm
Asriel can be hurt though and doesn’t have any powerful attacks to stop Tatsumi. The whole save file thing is an interesting 4th wall break but it won’t really help in a fight. Flowey has some good energy blasts but for the most part their combat feats are low. Tatsumi should just be able to go in and land a solid gut punch on Asriel. There’s not a whole lot that Asriel would be able to do against that. Asriel isn’t fast enough to dodge or land any counter blows. This would just be a punching combo to the end
By dreager1 on July 3, 2022 at 2:42 pm
Forgot this was here,
But anyway where is the proof of asriel being hurt in that form during the pacifist route. asriel has many ways to kill tatsumi
1 use the hyper goner, which is a giant goat skull that can erase an entire timeline
2 asriel’s chaos sabers are far more stronger then tatsumi’s average sword
3 asriel has ranged attacks like star blazing where he rains down stars at you while exploding into tiny stars, shocker breaker which can summon lightning to the ground, fire magic, and chaos buster which can fire magical bullets at the opponent as well as a rainbow laser.
4 asriel has control over existence, he is capable of destroying whole universes with just a fraction of his power. as well as be able to reset timelines. he’s invincible and overall practically unbeatable in terms of power,
while his speed is unknown as well as strength, things like that wont matter agiants someone who can erase timelines, destroy universes and is invincible
By wat on September 7, 2022 at 5:56 pm
The tricky thing with Undertale is separating the feats from the gameplay mechanics. I won’t deny that Asriel has a cool design and some nifty abilities but he won’t be moving with the same speed and ability that Tatsumi has. Speed is massively important here and yet it’s hard to decipher that from Undertale’s gameplay style. At the moment what we do know is that Tatsumi is fast though and his sword packs a punch.
Without seeing Asriel have any true super durability here, there’s no way for him to win. The stars attack isn’t literal and he’s definitely not destroying any universes or timelines. That’s where the hax have to be taken into consideration and his true power level is a whole lot lower. Undertale characters are really limited in that way
By dreager1 on September 10, 2022 at 1:09 pm
asriel being invincible is not a gameplay mechanic. its a real thing. If you check his stats he has infinite attack and defense. im talking the number eight flipped to its side, thats a real thing.
Not destroying any universes or timelines?
he legit outright says he was gonna destroy the timeline before pulling out hyper goner to destroy said timeline.
hell im not even mentioning the 2nd form, the 2nd form you cant even move at all and he ends up being far stronger.
While yes undertale characters are limited with feats and most of them outside their universes are weak. asriel is one that is far from weak.
Explain how tatsumi is meant to survive hyper goner or hell even damage asriel if he is invincible?
By wat on September 10, 2022 at 8:52 pm
Yeah but even that is a mechanic because nothing’s infinite. It does show that he is really strong though so I would definitely agree that he is tough. But lets say the whole timeline thing, Hyper Goner doesn’t look crazy strong. Tatsumi should be able to punch through that attack and land a solid stab. Asriel should not be able to have any trouble landing his blows with his sheer combat speed and I don’t think Asriel would be able to just shake off the stab without taking some serious damage here. Tatsumi’s showings in the anime are just better with speed and strength
By dreager1 on September 11, 2022 at 5:33 pm
IT is fiction. fiction is a story thats not real and has properties that cant be actually real. so even if infinity does not exist in the real world. in fiction, it can exist and has done so multiple times in stories wether you say it is or not.
2nd of all judging an attack by its looks is not a good way to emphasise how strong it is. looks can be deceiving. for example, people like sans, he seems like just a funny joke character, but then we see just how strong he was and how much he knew. then theres flowey, he looks innocent but in reality is one of the most evil characters in the game. there are also other examples from different video games, like kirby, kirby may seem all innocent, but in reality the dude is a multiverse ending god no cap. he fights off gods that could end universes on a daily basis.
hyper goner would just completely erase tatsumi and everything else with it.
Like i said. asriel is invincible, so why would a sword stab work? why would tatsumi’s speed and strength matter agiants an opponent who is permanently invincible.
By wat on September 12, 2022 at 4:38 pm
Asriel isn’t invincible though, just think of it as enhanced durability on a high level. Is it dangerous? Yes, but is it unstoppable? No. Tatsumi’s sword is quite strong and a few good slashes should quickly be able to start draining Asriel’s health away.
Infinity just doesn’t exist whether it’s fiction or real life. The reason for this is because there is always someone stronger, faster, smarter, etc. To introduce the concept of infinity would go against this and so it cannot be done. No verse can just say that there character has no limits or is invincible because there will always be someone to surpass that figure. That’s alll that I’m saying.
I agree that going by looks isn’t 100% the way to go but it’s still the best way most of the time. Kirby is a great example, you see people throwing a lot of hype his way like being multiversal and all but then you see him having trouble with street level opponents. Why the disconnect? It’s because everyone is looking more at lore and feats than what is actually happening. I’d put Kirby more as city block level for the most part. In general I don’t have the Undertale verse too high either but they get the job done I suppose.
By dreager1 on September 16, 2022 at 6:23 pm
Asriel isn’t invincible? wheres the proof? wheres the proof of asriel not being invincible, agian you just say he is not and then dont show proof of it at all.
In fiction infinity can exist. Everyone knows that fiction is not real, so what if infinity does not exist in the real world, it can exist in the fictional world. Your parents say you can write anything you want, your teachers do as well, especially english teachers, they even say you can, hell google even says you can and i already told you this before, here’s a quote from them “So, therefore, fiction takes on fiction-esque rules itself in that it is all made up. Rules don’t exist. If an author is talented enough to write a beloved story using emojis and pig Latin, then so be it.” There are only useful tips to writing a GOOD fictional story, if the writer wants pony’s and unicorns in their story, then they can have pony’s and unicorns in their story, i cant say anything about that, and neither can you.
Kirby is a literal god, when has he actually struggled with street level opponents? never, he has always been fighting gods. And hell why even bring up kirby struggling with weaker characters, remember, everyone learns from their past mistakes and grow’s,
Are you saying kirby losing agiants a weak street level opponent means he is really weak and all his previous fights with gods are worth nothing? Of course not, everyone still is learning, saying kirby would lose cause he lost of some random enemy thats really weak is the same as saying goku should lose all his fights cause he got one shotted by raditz, or naruto should lose cause he got knocked out by his daughter, or sasuke should lose cause he lost to rock lee in that one fight.
See what im saying, you cant judge a character based on their weakest feats alone, cause remember, Most of them still train, they get stronger, they improve. you say things like superman would lose to naruto cause he lost to the tripods? then i can easily say naruto wouldlose cause of a knockout from his daughter, or the time he got owned by rock lee, or every other time sakura punches him and beats him up? dare i say such things?
By wat on September 16, 2022 at 8:21 pm
I’m picking up what you’re putting down but it still doesn’t work that way. By your logic I could create a story right now and get it published with a character who is completely invincible so then he would be stronger than Goku. That doesn’t work though. Everything has limits so no matter what I write, he would be weaker than Goku.
Put it this way, no matter how good of a story teller I am, a book lead will not be stronger than Goku. I would need to get the rights to an anime and then start to top Goku that way. Even if I say my character has limitless strength and everything, it won’t be enough. Goku is too far beyond, he is the Saiyan of legend! A beast in battle, etc. There’s just no end there and that’s the same with stands and Asriel. He can’t be fully invincible because nobody is.
As for Kirby, I’m talking about every game where he gets injured by normal minions and blown around by the wind. If it was a one time thing then I’d agree with you but this is constant. Kirby just isn’t super strong like that. He never has been! It’s just the lore that makes him sound really strong and I’m trying to help you get past that. Kirby just isn’t that dude.
As for Sasuke and Naruto, they’ve grown stronger since then so it’s moot. Kirby never gets stronger or has training arcs so it’s the same guy that he was back in the first game. That’s what really hurts him in the end.
By dreager1 on September 17, 2022 at 11:15 am
If you want to create a story where the character is invincible and stronger then goku then go the fuck ahead, i cant say shit about what you wanna write.
Goku is still a character who can lose, he is a guy who pushes past his limits to achieve higher levels of power. but non the less, he can still lose. You dont need to produce a whole fucking anime on your character making his way to the top to beat goku. Whatever you write in your story is your law, you can make him with limitless strength, go the fuck ahead, do whatever you want, make him invincible, give him super speed, give him the power to blink a multiverse out of existence, These factors can beat goku, a guy who pushes past his limits, vs a guy who has no limits, in a fight like that. only one of them has limits to give at all.
Characters in a fictional story can be invincible, its just writers dont always choose that path, there not writing a story to create the most powerful warrior in existence. there writing a story to create a fun adventure and entertainment to the reader. Yes they can make their characters invincible if they choose too. You dont have obligations to say otherwise, your not the fucking law of book writing.
Yes kirby can get hurt by these enemy’s, but has he been defeated by them? no the fuck he does not. The game over screen you see when kirby dies is not apart of the actual story. Yes sure kirby getting hurt by enemies is common, being defeated by them, it hasn’t happend. it makes sense since he can survive a Planet exploding in his face and come out without a single scratch on him. Meanwhile naruto in His SAGE OF SIX PATHS FORM WITH KURAMA CHAKRA MODE, gets owned by a fucking sword. Oh im sorry im just looking at a characters weakest performance in their time cause by YOUR logic, they should lose cause of that. Luckily kirby has a sword form so one good stab and naruto’s screwed huh? Thats what your logic tells me.
Kirby does get stronger throughout his games and lore, the enemies and bosses get stronger and stronger and stronger.
By wat on September 17, 2022 at 12:18 pm
That’s the thing though, you can say something about what I write. Even if I write something like that, it doesn’t make it true. Even if I give him limitless strength, then he won’t be stronger than Goku yet. It would take a whole lot of on screen feats and showings to do it. Just putting text in doesn’t work. Otherwise anyone can do that. I may not be the law of book writing but trust me when I say that I’ve got some really serious pull there.
Kirby gets wrecked all the time. I agree that we can’t use the game overs as gameplay mechanics but the whole damage and setting is absolutely valid. Just look at the TV show. I think a lot of times we get lost in the sauce on this but Kirby just isn’t that dude. Trust me, it pains me to say this but Kirby isn’t ready for this.
As for Naruto, he’s proven time and time again why he is the Hokage of the Hidden Leaf village. Not only can he talk any villain to death but he can move with extreme speed and power. I guarantee you that you haven’t seen Kirby move as fast as Naruto. Naruto has combat feats for days and would win in an instant
By dreager1 on September 17, 2022 at 6:42 pm
Dude i cant say shit about what you wnat in your story, i can write one right now and make my character stronger, faster and overall more powerful then goku, saitama and naruto. Who is there to stop me? No one, Theres no law saying i cant do that.
On screen animation is there for more entertainment, for fun. You dont need to spend billions of money on a show to make a character stronger then goku. You can do that if you choose too. But that does not mean you have to.
Kirby in the show Just show’s how durable he is, Like fr the dude does not like have a single amount of blood on him despite all the shit he went through. When the same shit would have naruto injured. Like has naruto survived a planet sized explosion. No
Has naruto punched the ground so hard he cracks the planet in half? no, does naruto have a copy ability where the dude can just steal abilities or hell inhale his foes into his belly? no.
Yes naruto is amazing ok, i get it.
But bragging about how amazing he is is not gonna help him win. Kirby is able to pilot the warp star which moves FTL and even if he cant react to it, agian, he survived a planet sized explosion without a scratch.
By wat on September 17, 2022 at 7:06 pm
Naruto is amazing but this isn’t about that. Okay put it this way, Kirby is a great fighter with amazing powers and techniques. Nobody can take that away from him but at the same time, Naruto has the better showings. He is always fighting with aliens and other supernatural monsters and does so with pure combat ability. Kirby isn’t ready for those kinds of feats and has to survive on lore for his villains. That’s not going to cut it against a man like Naruto. Kirby has taken too many losses.
Trust me, just writing it is not enough. You absolutely need some animation or at least top tier manga images to get this across. Otherwise just writing saying that someone is stronger than Goku just doesn’t work. Nobody would believe it
By dreager1 on September 17, 2022 at 8:31 pm
Aliens? supernatural monsters? My guy kirby fights universe ending gods on a daily baises now, and he come out without a scratch on him. Agian all your looking at is kirby beign hurt by enemies, how do you know he loses to them? he doesn’t, cause the story progress’s.
You dont need animation ot manga images to make a character strong, you can but you dont have too.
By wat on September 17, 2022 at 9:29 pm
Yeah but those gods are really trying to live up to the hype. They aren’t nearly as strong as they appear. How else would Kirby not look all that strong all the time? He isn’t weak but he’s not super strong like that. Just look at any cutscene and it’s clear that Kirby isn’t universal
Trust me, the animation is absolutely necessary. You can only go so far with text.
By dreager1 on September 18, 2022 at 2:24 pm
They do live up to the hype, One of kirby’s strongest villans void termina, could destroy the fucking multiverse. Then we got fucking marx who shoots a laser that creates blackholes. And we got magalor, the dude can literally bend the universe to his will. Not a fucking single naruto and boruto character you would know could beat those 3.
The cutscenes in kirby keep having kirby beta up cause like i said, he is battling manaics like the 3 i mentioned like its a every day thing now.
Animation is not neccecary, sure with text you have to imagine the a fight happening but if the book cleraly states that a universe has been destroyed by a certain character, then yeah that character is universal.
By wat on September 18, 2022 at 4:54 pm
The Multiverse is good but it feels like a lot of guys can break it lately. Those villains all sound good on paper but then you see them in action and they aren’t super strong like that. I’d go on record to say that Naruto could absolutely destroy any of those guys low diff. I think you’re majorly underestimating how powerful Naruto is. He’s on a completely different level in terms of power and speed. You just can’t go against him. When he activates his ninjutsu there will be nowhere to run.
As for Kirby getting beat up, I’d say it’s still important. It’s clear that’s his intended strength and not the whole multiversal stuff. That just doesn’t hold up when you consider what kind of fighter Kirby is. He just isn’t that dude.
Nah a book just saying that isn’t going to fly. You need to see it to really appreciate the feats and stakes here
By dreager1 on September 23, 2022 at 8:39 pm
Naruto would actually get destroyed as stupid and corny as it sounds. the dude is nowhere near star level in the first place so why think he could take on universe ending gods. Naruto’s rasengan’s would mean nothing agiants them, naruto cant even pull off a city level kill with them.
I can tell ya that alot of people would say kirby would win over naruto
Like just look here
https://www.quora.com/Who-would-win-in-a-fight-Kirby-or-Naruto
You cant deny all this, these are other people who know what the 2 are capable of, hell one guy bumped naruto to planet destroying, tbh, thats really generous. But its still not enough.
A book can still make a story where a character is stronger then goku or kirby or whoever they want.
By wat on September 23, 2022 at 9:44 pm
That does sound a bit corny man. Cmon, Naruto isn’t losing to any of these guys. He could just grab the ole Rasengan and just start spamming. Those guys are all mistaken and falling for the Kirby lore hype. They’ve forgotten that Kirby just isn’t that dude. He’s not getting the big wins in the championship or showing up in the clutch situations. Why do you think he was absolutely getting devastated throughout the Kirby TV show?
He’s not on Naruto’s level just like most book characters never make it to the next level. The deck is stacked against them and it feels bad man. It feels….badddddddd
By dreager1 on September 24, 2022 at 3:43 pm
They dont fall for the kirby lore hype. there right about it. want me to start doubting the 4th great ninja war now? naruto needed the 5 nations and a buff from legit god himself while kriby just needed himself and a couple of friends, naruto had to seal away a god thats not even star level, while kirby destroyed a universal or hell multiversal god.
In the kirby tv show he fights a god too, and defeats him.all by himself in a fight.
By wat on September 24, 2022 at 5:22 pm
Yo, don’t be talking smack about my man Naruto. I don’t care how he did it, Naruto ended up beating everyone in his path. He proved once and for all that talent will always beat destiny. He’s the man with a plan and always comes out on top. As for the Kirbster, look I get it. He’s a cool character and we all want him to succeed. That’s fine but at the end of the day he’s not going to come out on top. It’s just not going to happen because he lacks the speed and raw power needed to make it all the way to the top.
By dreager1 on September 24, 2022 at 6:11 pm
If naruto needed the 5 great nations, the previous 4 hokage, and literal god himself to give himself and sasuke powers to fight agiants madara which btw even at his strongest is not even star level. There is no way he could stand up to enemies that are capable of destroying the universe or hell the multiverse.
Kirby’s warpstar can fly at FTL speeds and kirby can react fast enough to even pilot it. Meaning he can react to naruto’s attacks, even then if he gets it, he survived a planet sized explosions without a scratch. meanwhile madara, the strongest person in the war so far, got half his body destroyed by night guy, who is not even moon level.
And then theres the part where kirby could just inhale any ability naruto could throw at him. Hell kirby was able to crack his planet in half just by punching the ground.
Hell kirby threw a giant frying pan with a monster on it into fucking orbit to the sun and back. NOT A SINGLE NARUTO CHARACTER HAS DISPLAYED THAT MUCH STRENGTH BEFORE.
By wat on September 24, 2022 at 8:52 pm
Naruto didn’t need those guys much though. The hokages didn’t help much at all and the nations were fodder for the most part. Don’t get it twisted, Naruto is that guy. He could stand up to any villain who tries to defy him. Kirby’s warpstar isn’t ready for combat speed. It can travel around but in a fight Naruto is going to outmanuever that guy from day 1. There’s no escape from his incredible ninjutsu and taijutsu.
Kirby isn’t fast enough to keep up even if he can see Naruto coming and swallowing him would be a bad idea since Naruto could hit him from inside. That would be the ultimate game over moment.
By dreager1 on September 27, 2022 at 4:54 pm
Didn’t help him much, My guy naruto would have been dead if it was not for the 5 nations.
When naruto got the tailed beast ripped out of him, he needed sakura and gaara’s help to keep him alive, then have the other half of kurama sealed inside him, which was doen by a trying minato and then obito, and then is gifted fucking powers from hagaromo.
Hell the 5 great nations, the hokage’s and naruto struggled againts juubito, with juubito only losing cause plot and a change of heart. they even struggled with the ten tails alone, and naruto had killer bee the 5 greta nations legit so many people helping.
Now imagine that but its just naruto, fucking dead.
If it travels FTL and kirby can pilot it FTL, then kirby’s reaction should be FTL even if its not, agian, kirby survived a planet explosion, a fucking black hole.
and no if kirby swallows him naruto could not destroy kirby from the inside, kirby’s stomach is a legit seperate diemension, we find this out in the kirby tv show, though i highly doubt you watched it.
Naruto would have to legit destroy a entire dimension. not happening.
By wat on September 27, 2022 at 7:50 pm
Yeah Naruto would have died a few times but at the end of the day he knew they were there so that affected how he fought. If he knew that he was truly alone then he would have used a lot more tactics. Probably still would have died but no shame in dying against one of the strongest opposing armies in history. Sometimes there just isn’t a whole lot that you can do against an impressive force like this. You just have to hold the L and hope for the best. It’s all any of us can do really.
I wouldn’t agree with that. Plenty of people pilot trains that are supersonic or jets that are hypersonic but we don’t give them those kinds of reaction times. Piloting is just that…piloting. The speed is different because of physics. As for the Kirby stomach dimension, yeah I’ve kind of seen that too in theory but you can still bust out of there. Think of it as more of an abstract dimension. Naruto just needs to focus his chakra and use one of his Bijuu bombs to get out
By dreager1 on October 1, 2022 at 11:05 am
Alot more tactics would not have helped, agiants juubito, he would be screwed, that tailed beast bomb cage attack that obito was about to send out would have killed naruto, the allied shinobi forces only were able to survive cause they ha dthe help of both naruto and minato to teleport them out, naruto never knew the flying raijin jutsu and even then would not have the seal ready to do so. even when naruto was fighting juubito with sasuke they coudl not even beat him, why would naruto alone do better?
If that was kirby, the dude would have probably swallowed all the tailed beast bombs. or hell, use the star rod agiants obito and madara, cause the star rod is really good when destroying evil forces.
The difference is that pilots are not fucking moving FTL. Hell they probably would die doing that.
Kirby’s stomach diemension is just that, a diemension. its not an abstract one, cause people could interact with it, besides its how kriby can activate alot of his powers. Hell with the hypernova fruit, its gg’s, In that form kirby’s inhale ability is just blown off the charts.
By wat on October 1, 2022 at 11:51 am
I agree that the Tailed Beast Bomb cage is absolutely insane. Tactics would have been tough but maybe he could have dodged in time or used a ninjutsu to break the cage before it was formed. Not saying Naruto would definitely win, but we’ve seen him beat the odds time and time again. With enough dedication and conviction to the cause, there is no opponent that Naruto can’t defeat. He is that dude and would absolutely keep on fighting all the way to the end. Nobody’s taking him down!
As for Kirby, I think he wouldn’t have the space for that many beasts. They would just be too much for him and my pilot logic is still sound because they aren’t supersonic either. It’s pilot mechanics that affect the feats even in the real world.
By dreager1 on October 2, 2022 at 7:20 pm
Dodged a tailed beast bomb thats in a cage, a cage thats more stronger then the hokages cage. and at the time both hashirama and minato were stronger then naruto. No way would naruto be able to dodge nor break the cage.
Dedication and determination cannot always give you the win.
Enough space? kirby’s stomach is a whole new fucking dimension, with the hypernova fruit, he would have swallowed all of that shit whole. Even then he would have survived the blast, cause like i said, he survived a planet sized explosion without a scratch, while the tailed beats bombs were only capable of destroying mountains, not even close to moon level.
It snot pilot mechanics, its the fact that the pilots dont travel faster then light. Thats why there reaction speeds arent as high, cause there not trying to pilot a fucking star that travels FTL.
By wat on October 3, 2022 at 1:11 am
Naruto can break the cage I’d say because he was stronger than Minato. Hashirama is more debatable but in terms of pure power? It’s hard to go higher than Naruto.
As for Kirby’s dimension, dimension busting isn’t all that crazy if you focus your power. Naruto should be able to do that with a tailed beast bomb or just slowly suck Kirby’s life force away in Baryon Mode. Kirby’s not walking away from that kind of fight because Naruto just scales higher in combat.
As for the pilots, I’m still saying that their reactions don’t scale to the speed of the vehicle. That’s all and it makes sense
By dreager1 on October 9, 2022 at 1:31 pm
Naruto at the time was not stronger then minato.
Minato was faster and had more expirence and has similar ability’s to Naruto himself.
Hashirama at the time would beat Naruto.
The wood golem jutsu could take on madara’s susanoo. And he’ll the wood golden was the very thing that suppressed the nine tails’s chakra.
Hell in madara and hashirama’s final battle.
Madara legit had his Susanoo wrapped around kurama himself. And the wood golden supressed the nine tails chakra with ease. No way would Naruto be able to take on hashirama.
You can’t just destroy anything in your path by focusing your power. Since when has Naruto even destroyed a diemension or hell a planet before?
From what I researched kirby actually has a HUGE life span. Cause apparently their species has Huge ass life spans that last them century’s. Even then baryon mode does not last very long. Hell it’s life span power did not really do much agiants isshiki.
From what we see baryon mode lasts 30 minutes and in the battle against isshiki, Naruto got isshiki’s lifespan down from 20 hours to 10 minutes.
Not bad and pretty dangerous but then again.
Isshiki did not even have a day to live.
And considering how Kirby has century’s to live. Baryon mode would be a complete waste and a huge sacrifice to Naruto, and would put him at a big disadvantage once his 30 minutes are up.
The speed of a vehicle does not scale to a fucking jet or plane.
By wat on October 9, 2022 at 8:57 pm
Minato’s abilities were similar but he wasn’t a power type the way that Naruto was. It felt like Naruto could have crushed him with a powerful jutsu at any point and Minato would not have been able to stop him. Especially since the speed was equalized at that point. For Hashirama, I see Naruto winning with pure speed. He could be trapped as you mentioned, but I don’t think that Hashirama would be fast enough to get Naruto like that. Not if it was a 1 on 1 fight at least.
Naruto’s best destruction feat is less than a planet but he’s never had to destroy a dimension before. He should be able to pull this off as long as he focuses up and Kirby’s durability is a little more untested. Kirby probably wouldn’t even know that his life is being drained and that’s what will hurt him. Especially since Kirby can’t fight back, Naruto will just keep absorbing him and replenishing his own power.
The speed doesn’t scale but it’s the same concept. Piloting something doesn’t give you reaction times.
By dreager1 on October 12, 2022 at 11:01 am
False,
It was stated throughout the story that minato was still stronger with kcm. if minato without kcm could stop a tailed beast bomb, the naruto would not be any different.
Naruto winning with speed is unlikely, while he cant move as fast as naruto his reaction time makes up for it, besides he is far more experienced, had a much more destructive arsenal, and hell even naruto was stopped by yamato with wood. wood jutsu’s have been capable of supressing chakra, and hell hashirama could keep up with madara, who do I really need to explain why that’s impressive? The moment naruto is grabbed he is finished. hell hashirama could have just summoned His wood release true several thousand hand jutsu to obliterate naruto, it was able to beat kurama covered in madara’s susanoo, so I don’t think a kurama chakra avatar is gonna survive either.
Hell its even stated that naruto almost had as much chakra as hashirama, key word being ALMOST, so hashirama still had more chakra to spare.
If naruto cant even destroy a entire planet, why the hell would you think he could destroy a diemension.
And when has baryon mode been shown to absorb and replenish his energy, ist the complete opposite, its actually draining his energy by just using baryon mode.
And I already said how kirby has survived a planetary destruction blast. Naruto’s 30 minutes in baryon mode would be a waste.
Pilioting something gives you better reaction times if you move fast enough while weaving between a lot of obstacles.
Kirby’s warp star moves FTL and there has been times where he had to constantly weave around enemey’s.
By wat on October 12, 2022 at 5:56 pm
Minato didn’t look super impressive in the final war though. He was getting his limbs shot off as if he wasn’t even moving. Meanwhile Naruto didn’t take any lethal hits like that and was dishing out the damage. It’s hard to see Minato doing all of that.
Now I agree that if Naruto is grabbed then he could be finished, but Naruto is so fast and resourceful that it would be extremely difficult to pin him down. I’m not sure if Hashirama really has that much energy left within him or if he would just go down. It would be interesting though.
So for the dimensions, I find that it’s not always as strong as a planet. Just focus on an area to rip a hole in the dimension and you’re all set. So technically that’s all that Naruto has to do and then he would be out of Kirby’s headspace. It should definitely be feasible for him to pull this off. As for Baryon, I was thinking he would just hold onto Kirby’s life energy as he drains it and add on to his own.
Kirby’s travel speed is really good so I can buy into the FTL part but it won’t help in combat speed. There’s nothing he would be able to do against a guy like Naruto and without the star I’d say that Kirby isn’t even supersonic.
By dreager1 on October 15, 2022 at 8:26 pm
Minato was legit being bodied by juubito, fucking juubito. as well as juubi madara, naruto on his own could not defeat them.
No lethal hits? Naruto legit died when his tailed beast got extracted.
Besides his limbs would have gotten torn off too if he was hit by the truth seeking balls.
Hell when the ten tails was rampaging he was wounded and needed sakura to recover his strength.
Hashirama can keep up with madara in a fight. and we know danm well madara at the time would wipe the floor with naruto. Besides hashirama is a more smart fighter then naruto with more experience.
Now of course naruto did surpass hashirama when he was given so6p.
But again it was gifted by hagaromo for when he died.
Even then, naruto was given only the yang half. while juubito and juubimadara had the yin yang and yin-yang paths
How the hell would naruto be capable of ripping a hole through space and reality?
For one he has never done that, your just assuming he can, The only people who have been capable of ripping holes into different dimensions are those with rinnegan and the karma ability. Naruto has neither of those.
Even then, the diemension is STILL kirby’s stomach.
Kirby can actually control what he stores in his stomach and what is completely destroyed.
After digging kirby’s stomach diemensionis called the copy palette, where he stores all his food and stuff. He can choose to either use whatever is in their for battle or combine stuff to create new things, dude’s got an entire lab in their.
But like i said he could also choose what to destroy. So if naruto is inhaled and enters his stomach, then well kirby could just, completely destroy naruto.
Or hell gain his ability’s.
Who knows.
Baryon mode does not work like that, naruto only drains the life energy off of something,not gain it for himself.
Besides not that it would matter cause once the 30 minutes are up naruto would have lost kurama and his great strength speed durability and regeneration ability’s as well as his unholy amounts of chakra.
Why would you suspect naruto in baryon mode could take out kirby who has bundles of years left to live, when he cant even last 30 minutes, and in those 30 minutes he can’t even get a guy who does not even have a day to live down enough till he dies.
With kirby’s warp star he could simply speedblitz naruto and just fire from a distant.
even then i did mention the whole, kirby survived a planet explosion thing
By wat on October 20, 2022 at 4:49 pm
Minato was getting bodied, I definitely agree with that but he’s just not ready to hang with the big guns like Naruto was. He still has the speed advantage though so if I was putting him up against the 1st Hokage then it should be a big win in his favor. Speed is always the best factor to have in a fight after all.
Now for Baryon Naruto, it’s important to note that his speed and power are incredible! Isshiki was still landing blows and stuff to weaken him but Kirby wouldn’t have any of that. Naruto should be able to just completely dismantle this guy in combat and I say that as a very casual Kirby fan. Kirby may have some decent moves but he’s way too slow and has trouble with street level fighters. That’s the big difference between him and a guy like Naruto. It’s hard to get around that.
I think we’re overrating Kirby a bit here. If he was so tough then why would he be having so much trouble in Dreamland? It doesn’t make any sense so I just have to push back on that one. #NotMyKirby Kirby is a good fighter but the realm of Nintendo can rarely hold its own against true anime fighters. It’s just not happening.
By dreager1 on October 28, 2022 at 3:37 pm
Speed does not instantly mean you win. Even if hashirama is likely slower, would naruto be capable of actually putting him down with his strength? Even then could naruto keep up with dodging hashirama’s wood style absorption?
Likely not.
Hashirama could battle against madara who naruto did not even stand a chance against at the time.
The problem is that your looking at kirby from some random point in his adventure. Last time I checked, i don’t think gods that create blackholes and are strong enough to destroy multiverses are street level.
Can naruto punch with the power of a planet? No, even then kirby would survive.
Naruto has been shown numerous times on how much he gets hurt while kirby has not even bled or shown a scratch on him once.
Kirby’s dreamland is SUPER old, that’s kirby WAY back in the past, even then kirby in dreamland already fought a god anyway.
Remember, we both trying to look at these characters in at their best, not their worst, but then you mention kirby when he was starting out.
You don’t see me mentioning kid naruto feats.
By wat on October 28, 2022 at 5:00 pm
I’d say yes, Naruto’s attacks would really dish out a lot of damage. It’s why speed is so important. So long as you can hurt your opponent then having the speed advantage will always result in a win. It’s only when you can’t hurt someone that speed starts to get in your way instead. That gap isn’t quite so crazy here though. So that’s why Naruto should be able to win here.
It’s not about mentioning Kirby’s older feats but that it still applies to the newest one. Have you played the latest Switch game? He still has trouble with everyone and barely seems to be city block level. There’s no way he’s tanking Naruto’s hits. The gameplay mechanics make Kirby seem really powerful but at the end of the day he’s just a dude and nobody can take down Naruto like that. His abilities are much too fierce!
By dreager1 on October 28, 2022 at 6:14 pm
Dude it takes just one slip up for naruto to be caught by hashirama’s wood style ability’s, plus even if naruto was faster, hashirama at the time was stronger and had more experience then naruto. Hashirama would no doubt be able to catch naruto even if he was faster.
Dude kirby being hurt by the enemy’s in a stage is a gameplay mechanic.
Of course he manages to instantly win against them no sweat.
Agian bro, taking kirby’s planet explosion feat out of context wont help, considering how he also scales to king dedede, who survived being sucked into a black hole.
Naruto is not surviving.
Even then kirby could just absorb all of naruto’s power and gain his ability’s for his own.
By wat on October 28, 2022 at 9:17 pm
There won’t be a slip up though and Naruto would have won by then. Naruto’s raw strength is just way too incredible. All will fall before his mighty abilities and a massive giant Rasengan would end things real quick too. Hashirama doesn’t have the same level of combat experience on his side which is what will hurt him quite massively here. He would have needed some really good techniques and all to win but he doesn’t have those. The wood isn’t enough.
As for Kirby, he is still not one of the most powerful fighters. He regularly has trouble with normal opponents and his higher end feats tend to involve toon force and a bit of luck. Naruto would absolutely crush him in a fight due to the speed difference and change in power levels.
By dreager1 on November 5, 2022 at 9:04 am
There wont be a slip up?, Naruto has had many slip up’s, like when he forgotto use sage jutsu to even hurt juubito, and needed tobirama to remind him. and hell NARUTO WAS THE ONE WHO THOUGHT OF IT IN THE FIRST PLACE. even tobirama said he was more dumber then hashirama.
If hashirama’s wood golem could stand up to madara’s susanoo, then it would be able to stand up against a chakra tailed beast form. after all that’s what hashirama did fight.
Hashirama has far more combat experience on his side then naruto, dude fought in wars when he was still young.
The wood would drain naruto’s chakra or completely dispell any attempts of hurting hashirama.
When the fuck has toon force been stated in kirby, You dont even know what your talking about, you do 0 research.
You keep forgetting that its a game mechanic. of course kirby stomps all the normal opponents.
Afterall, at least kirby did more of his journeys on his own. While I ended up listing a whole fuckign list of times naruto needed help in isshiki vs darkseid.
By wat on November 5, 2022 at 10:55 am
Naruto slips up sometimes when he’s having fun but in a full fight that’s not happening. Naruto is combat ready and that’s where his true genius shines. Just give him a few minutes to really get going and he’ll show you combos for days. This guy doesn’t let up and never slows down. Naruto would be able to crush the golem and keep on going. Hashirama’s only chance is if Naruto messes up and doesn’t dodge a hit but that doesn’t seem very likely. I don’t think it would happen at least.
It can’t be a mechanic though because this is the case for Kirby in the cutscenes and the anime as well. He’s just not that dude. Kirby is powerful I’ll give you that but he’s not this big planet buster that everyone thinks he is. He’s a fun Nintendo mascot who is stronger than he looks but that’s about it. He’s still getting rocked by all the big fighters.
By dreager1 on November 6, 2022 at 6:43 pm
I fr hoping your not talking about hokage naruto for this one cause I’m referring to naruto during the juubito fight. or before he got access to so6p
Hokage naruto can and will beat hashirama
but the version of naruto before so6p, hell naw.
Hashirama was a far more experienced fighter and even if faster, could still figure out naruto’s speed, after all, he has sage mode too.
The time kirby gets shit on in cutscenes are by literal gods, and the anime, is not canon. sorry dude.
Why look at kirby’s feats low feats and say he wont do well? again there not really meant to happen and are just there for entertainment purposes of gameplay.
By wat on November 6, 2022 at 8:34 pm
Yeah Naruto during Juubito would absolutely crush Hashirama. Experience doesn’t mean as much when your stats are so much lower. He would spend most of the fight getting absolutely devastated by Naruto with no real way to make a comeback. That is what really hurts him here. It’s that he just wouldn’t be able to jump in there and make a difference, not so easily at least.
It’s not about looking for Kirby’s low feats but seeing that he’s consistently not portrayed to be super strong so it makes everything else feel a bit dubious. Perhaps he isn’t nearly as strong as he wants us to think he is? It would add a whole lot of depth to the Kirby mythos and I for one am quite nervous about that. It’s hard to see Kirby taking on any of the big threats.
By dreager1 on November 12, 2022 at 11:09 am
The problem is people downplay expirence far too much in combat, even then why did you assume naruto’s stats were better, naruto
Does not have as much chakra as hashirama
does not have more experience
does not have the arsenal to stand up to hashirama
does not have the power needed.
does not have the durability needed.
Agian hashirama has already fought kurama with susanoo armour that was guided by madara, why would naruto be different? in fact, its probably weaker. Besides his 1000 arm wood thing that he used against kurama cloaked susanoo absolutely devastated it. no sweat would it be able to destroy naruto’s kurama cloak.
Agian dude, just cause he has some random point in his timeline where he has had a falling, does not mean it fully effects his full power, even then, at least he did most of his feats on his own. Unlike naruto
By wat on November 12, 2022 at 12:47 pm
Naruto is a better all around fighter. Hashirama is older and doesn’t have as much stamina. His jutsu are more uninspired and he doesn’t have Naruto’s will to win. Naruto should be able to easily clobber Hashirama due to his speed and his overall abilities. Hashirama would be on the back foot right from the start and I don’t see him making a comeback. It really boils down to the fact that Naruto can fight even without Kurama so together they are just too powerful. Naruto may have needed help but in the end his feats were always in a league of their own. Isn’t that what matters?
By dreager1 on November 19, 2022 at 5:40 pm
Just cause hashirama has lived longer does not mean his stamina lacks compared to naruto. Doesn’t have naruto’s will, dude had to kill off his best friend in order to protect the leaf village from danger, dude had to fight through wars since his childhood. I’m pretty sure he too is just as willful as naruto.
Naruto’s speed wont matter, speed cant always win you a fight, especially if the other guy could suck and suppress all your chakra with their jutsu.
If hashirama is a guy who can fight madara’s susanoo for several days and end up being the victor in the end, and then fight him again when he is stronger, then why the hell is naruto going to succeed with his current state, yes right now naruto with so6p beats hashirama but I’m trying to discuss naruto when he was fighting juubito.
By wat on November 19, 2022 at 6:36 pm
Naruto could have done all of that in spades. Hashirama did real good so I don’t want to take that away from him but there’s a reason why the series is called Naruto and not Hashirama. Naruto even at that point during the Juubito fight was more than a match for Hashirama and would have defeated him in short order. The clones aren’t fast enough and no trees are going to grab Naruto. He would be running around past the speed of sound and just landing devastating blows throughout
By dreager1 on November 19, 2022 at 7:26 pm
Dude no shit naruto surpasses hashirama by the end of the series, I’m saying that hashirama during the war arc was still stronger then naruto during the juubito arc.
No tree’s catching naruto, naruto and his friends legit almost die by the divine tree sucking out their chakra.
Hell hashirama was able to dodge every vine from the divine tree, while naruto got caught and almost died but thanks to hiruzen, was saved.
And in case your wondering yes naruto was trying to out pace the vines but still got caught anyway
By wat on November 19, 2022 at 7:38 pm
I follow you but Naruto solos Hashirama even during the Juubito arc. He was a lot faster and stronger at this point in time. The vines would not be enough to stop him, no shot! Naruto would just keep on running. I won’t deny that he got caught once but he was trying to protect everyone and got distracted. In a one on one fight that never would have happened because Naruto is That dude. He would have kept on fighting right up through to the end and Hashirama would not be able to hit him.
By dreager1 on November 24, 2022 at 4:05 pm
Proof of naruto being stronger then hashirama?
Got distracted? dude was caught cause he could not outspeed it.
And then there’s hashirama, jumping from vine to vine dodging every single one while speaking with madara.
That chakra drain, is exactly what would happen once hashirama hits him with the seal.
Hell, this is the very same dude who nullified kurama’s chakra with his wood golem.
hell look
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-3ac146e9664a679e8fbb5f50b11a1038-lq
This is naruto struggling to beta a single wood dragon, and this was from just madara, we are talking about hashirama who is far better at wood jutsu then madara.
and this is what hashirama can summon
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-c61771b5ae265772fea4a3410b6a59b7-lq
and this wood buddha
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-f5608452a12a36e71fdd46e36b693577-lq
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-db526dedc17e6750db8119ed6413020b-lq
Just yanked kurama, hell kurama was not even bigger then its hand.
By wat on November 24, 2022 at 6:44 pm
Proof? Naruto beat up Madara, Kaguya, Isshiki, and Jigen. Even if this is just Naruto at this point in the manga, he was already faster and stronger than Hashirama. The guy died for a reason while Naruto was still cooking. There is not a Kage alive or dead who can match Naruto’s power. Naruto does struggle quite a lot during the fights but that’s because he is always going up against the absolute strongest fighters across the cosmos. If you put him up against anyone even slightly weaker than that then it’s all over. That would be the end of the match in an instant. I didn’t want to say it but it just be like that.
You did put up some very convincing links but those wood abilities are all limited while Naruto can just move freely on his own. Mix in his impressive strength and that would be the end of the match.
By dreager1 on December 3, 2022 at 6:06 pm
Your actually stupid, we are talking about the naruto during the juubito fight, naruto at the time was no where close to madara, kaguya isshiki or jigen. and hell, all 4 battles you mentioned, naruto needed help.
dude if madara, someone at the time who was more experienced and more powerful then naruto, lost to hashirama, hashirama wont have trouble beating naruto during juubito arc, especially with his new gates that he would use to fuckigng hold down the ten tails.
By wat on December 4, 2022 at 12:04 am
I know we’re talking about the Juubito fight but Naruto would still be clobbering everyone. Sure he would have lost to Jigen and Isshiki but he could take Kaguya with the speedblitz. Hashirama just isn’t handling a speed fighter like that.
Honestly I don’t even know why Madara had so much trouble with him. Hashirama’s plants are good but without pure speed to back you up it’ll never be enough. All he can do is play defense but eventually Naruto is going in for the win and he’s going to be Mad! That’s not an opponent you really want to have to deal with.
By dreager1 on December 4, 2022 at 8:17 pm
Speedblizt kaguya?
Even when naruto had so6p he still could not speedblitz or even beat kaguya, and he even had help with fucking rinnegan sasuke, sakura and kakashi abd obito.
What makes you think naruto during the juubito fight could stand a chance?
Madara had trouble because hahsirama was far too strong, speed does not mean everything. and plus if hashirama could keep up with madara, but naruto cant keep up with madara until he got so6p. then no naruto cant. plus speedblizting requires not only speed but strength too. you need to be strong enough to even hurt the attacker.
And plus that’s almost impossible since hashirama at the time was a reanimation, but even if he was not, hashirama can still react fast enough or even be able to grab naruto once with his better expirence.
By wat on December 4, 2022 at 9:11 pm
Kaguya is tough but she’s not quite fast enough to really keep up with Naruto. He could definitely speedblitz her at this point and it’s something he should have tried a lot more during their fight. I think he was overwhelmed by her overall ability but it’s fair to say that in normal circumstances she would not be able to do a whole lot against him. Naruto is just way too powerful, he is That guy! It’s what makes him such an intense fighter.
I trust in Naruto’s hand to hand and combat speed enough where I think he would be able to dominate the fight, even when it was the him during the Juubito fight. Madara and Naruto should still be able to take Hashirama down pretty quick. His plants just aren’t strong enough to survive their combined assault. It’s why they are known as such legendary fighters. They go in hard! They have more skills than most opponents would even dream of. It’s what makes them impressive fighters. Hashirama is more of a one trick pony with the plants and summoning.
He is still super strong absolutely but not strong enough
By dreager1 on December 17, 2022 at 8:28 pm
Kaguya is far stronger then naruto even when naruto was a adult. In this time period it would take naruto and sasuke to beat kaguya, but not kill her.
In the fight, naruto could not speedblitz kaguya,because trying to speedblitz someone with a Rinne Sharingan and byakugan is pretty much setting yourself up for a smack in the face. plus, naruto could not really damage her anyway, even when he had like several tailed beast rasen shurikens from the many different tailed beasts, he only caused minor damage to him. Plus Amaterasu from sasuke was harmless too.
In the juubito fight, madara was stronger then hashirama, but hashirama was still stronger then naruto at the time. Madara was stronger thanks to his new rinnegan and wood style jutsu abilities and extra buffs he got from kabuto.
Also, your combining naruto and madara’s power? the hell you on?
No shit they win.
But naruto on his own wont.
Hashirama with his wood style jutsu can pretty much create many different possibilities. Both madara and hashirama displayed such abilities before that put the 5 kage to shame.
By wat on December 17, 2022 at 10:19 pm
I dunno about Kaguya being stronger than Naruto as an adult. I see Naruto being able to beat her 1 on 1 because Kaguya only had a slight edge when they were teens. Once his stats are above hers then it should be a straight shot to getting the W. She would have a hard time keeping up with him and the whole dimension shifting was a bit erratic so she wouldn’t want to rely on that for too long.
Madara’s abilities were always more impressive than Hashirama’s though, even in base. The Sharingan was just so broken and physically they were already on the same level too so the visual jutsu just puts him in a different level. That said, I do agree that both of them are way above the 5 Kage who are really disgraceful.
By dreager1 on January 18, 2023 at 11:19 pm
No, he cant, every otsutsuki member naruto has fought he always had sasuke to back him up,though with urashiki im sure naruto can win, but otutsuki members like momoshiki, kaguya, isshiki, possibly kinshiki, he needed help from sasuke.
Im not saying hahsirama can beat madara with rinnegan and wood style, im saying hashirama was still better wat wood style then madara, but thanks to the added buff of the sharingan and rinnegan, madara had the edge.
But naruto would fall to both of these guys, After all naruto with his kurama chakra mode avatar was instantly restrained by a wood dragon. Because wood can suppress the tailed beast powers. and naruto needed help to even escape.
Naruto during the juubito arc just could not beat hashirama, when naruto gains so6p though, then yes naruto shits on hashirama
By wat on January 19, 2023 at 5:01 pm
Sure I can agree that Hashirama was specifically better than Madara at wood style. It was his specialty so for sure that seems reasonable. That said, Naruto would still crush Hashirama quickly if he was serious. His clones would take care of the wood dragons while he just takes him out in hand to hand. His strength and overall power level are just way too high for anything less than that. He would be able to just go in and take names that way. It’s why I’d also say Naruto can beat the aliens because he has the shadow clones at the ready. I think he didn’t use them enough in the series tbh
By dreager1 on January 19, 2023 at 7:08 pm
Absolutely not naruto’s clones would have their chakra suppressed by the wood dragons.
Why?
Because naruto’s shadow clones don’t support enough chakra needed to sustain themselves in long term fights, besides whats stopping hashirama from just making more?
Even then hashirama has wood clones too which could match that of naruto’s shadow clones.
And like i said, the 100arm buddha thing outsized kurama, so its safe to say naruto is going to die by that
Yes naruto has overpowered wood style jutsu before, but only against weaker wood styles, yamato’s madara’s etc, but hashirama? No
He would need so6p to beat hashirama by then.
and also what aliens?
are you referring to the otsutsuki’s
If so then he still needed so6p to contend with them.
And no not counting juubito
Juubito lost because of the fact that he had lost the will to fight, that as well as that naruto needed sasuke along with the rest fo the allied shinobi forces to help.
and for a bonus
its not that naruto did not use them enough.
Its because he cant always spam millions of clones whenever he feels like it
He still has limited chakra, sure he has a absurd amount of it but still limited, especially since he has other techniques besides shadow clone spam.
that’s why by the near end of the series , he only summons 2 to 3 clones during hand to hand fights or summons a thousand of them for distractions or to counter against an army.
By wat on February 25, 2023 at 2:30 am
Yeah Naruto can be suppressed but at the end of the day he will still win. I think we are heavily overestimating the amount of power that Hashirama has. There is a good reason why he is always hiding behind the trees and that’s because he just can’t keep up in terms of hand to hand skills or overall talent and ability. Naruto would absolutely decimate him in a fair fight and that’s why the guy wouldn’t want to go up against him.
Juubito did lose the will to fight so I can agree with that. That said, Naruto can definitely spam millions of clones if he wants too. The only reason he didn’t do this is because at the time he was just completely overwhelmed with fighting so many opponents. In a one on one fight at full power I absolutely do think he could spam a few million without breaking a sweat. It’s not something that would be so impossible for him to manage at all. Honestly it should be an easy feat at this point.
He still has the better techniques and speed at his side so that should result in a really quick win imo
By dreager1 on March 2, 2023 at 4:18 pm
we are not, if anything you underestimate every hokage besides naruto.
Hashirama could keep up with madara in like every category besides arsenal and maybe strength. And madara was the guy who could deal with sage mode naruto, gaara, onoki, and a whole shinobi army. then the 5 kage and the tailed beasts. and hashirama was the only person that madara wanted to fight at the time, during their battle in the 4th shinobi war, he was the only person there that could deal with madara’s susanoo.
Naruto cannot spam millions of clones, the most clones we have seen him use at once is like about 5000, and even then that’s only in naruto ultimate ninja storm 4 by naruto (the last) ultimate move, which btw ain’t canon.
but even then hashirama’s true several thousand hands could easily wipe out the clones and the kurama avatar, after all its bigger then the kurama avatar that naruto can make.
We are completely off topic about what the actual debate is about because you dragged about infinity not being real, forcing kirby to come up and then somehow naruto got into the mix.
The whole point was to prove who would win, asriel or tatsumi.
And asriel, with his feats could easily kill off tatsumi.
By wat on March 2, 2023 at 4:57 pm
Naruto easily clears all of the other Hokages though and it makes sense because he is the child of legend. The embodiment of Indra and the other original heroes who were so good. Naruto has been through more than most characters can ever achieve and he didn’t do that through hard work and dedication but through passion and talent. Madara clears Hashirama easily but for some reason they were billed as rivals within the show anyway. I never quite understood why so don’t ask me but that’s just how it is. It goes hard either way and I do want to say that Hashirama is still strong. He’s just not on the same level as someone like Naruto. No way….no how!
Yeah this did go off tangent. I say Tatsumi wins this one though. We overestimate Undertale as a verse in general. Asriel has a lot of interesting meta abilities in the game but the fighters aren’t all that strong. Tatsumi is still faster and stronger which is what counts.
By dreager1 on March 10, 2023 at 10:00 am
Naruto as an adult or with so6p yes can beat all the other 6 hokages of course not without some level of difficulty. But i ain’t talking about so6p or adult naruto, its kcm 2 sage mode naruto that I’m talking about.
Your also apparently stupid because naruto is not the incarnation of indra, he is the incarnation of ashura.
The reason why madara could beat hashirama during the 4th great shinobi war was because madara was much stronger then hashirama when they fought, not to mention that madara had gained wood style jutsu and the rinnegan along with his eternal mangekyo sharingan. And even then he was still struggling to beat hashirama at the time, I’m not saying hashirama could have won, he would not, but hashirama was close to madara’s level.
But back in their prime days it was just madara with eternal mangekyo vs hashirama with his wood style, and when madara returned with a kurama cloaked susanoo, hashirama had fought back with his true several thousand hands, which he never used in the war arc.
Tatsumi still cant win against asriel.
Yes literally 97$ of the undertake cast are weak and tatsumi could easily dispose of them, but the remaining 3 being the human,omega flowey and asriel are battles he ain’t winning.
Because all 3 of them posses the power to reset, or destroy a timeline.
For one, asriel like i had already said has infinite stats. Making every attempt to kill him useless
and asriel has hyper goner which could eat infinite timelines.
and in case your wondering, 1 timeline=1 universe
Tatsumi has not shown anything on the scale of universal destruction.
By wat on March 10, 2023 at 1:18 pm
KCM 2 Sage Mode Naruto solos all the Kages. I mix up Indra and Ashura tbh but they’re basically the same character. The reason I don’t take Hashirama seriously is because he doesn’t have the Sharingan or any kind of visual jutsu that could even the scales. There is just no way for him to stack up against Madara even briefly, let alone Naruto. Wood style just isn’t that impressive so I always have to give him the L there.
Destroying timelines and resetting things are not going to do much against Tatsumi. It only worked in game due to gameplay mechanics since the guy was basically trapped in a video game sort of like SAO. In terms of combat feats Asriel doesn’t really have much to go with. There is no path to victory here because Tatsumi has strong fundamentals and a good amount of speed and strength.
By dreager1 on March 25, 2023 at 6:15 pm
No, he can’t sure he could beat tsunade, hiruzen and maybe tobirama, and minato with kcm2 is debatale, but hashirama is someone he is not beating at the time
What do you mean wood style isn’t impressive? It is by far one of the strongest nature transformations in naruto besides yin-yang release.
it’s already proven it’s worth when characters like madara and danzo had gone through so much trouble just to get hashirama’s cells into them so they could use wood style. And the fact that hashirama had contained and captured the tailed beasts before proves this even more.
Wood style is highly versatile and it’s ability to just absorb chakra and its destructive techniques are what make it extremely dangerous. Even low level wood style user’s like yamato had been praised about his wood style techniques. There’s a reason why during the battle between hashirama and madara, hashirama had won twice, it’s only when madara gained the rinnegan and wood style himself was when he could easily overpower hashirama.
Why are you comparing Undertale to SAO? That’s not how the undertale verse works, Yes the undertale franchise is a video game but that doesn’t make it a game in it’s own verse. Undertale is not a Vr game like SAO.
By that logic, Mario’s feats were fake because he’s a video game.
What gameplay mechanics? Asriel not being hurt during the battle? Even if you argue the human not being able to harm asriel was a gameplay mechanic, his defense stat says infinite which is already proof enough to the point where someone like tatsumi would be unable to harm him.
Asirel even states that he can indeed reset timelines and even destroy them during the fight with the human, the only reason he couldn’t was because both him and the human’s determination matched each other.
And he stated this when he was only using a fraction of his power.
Tatsumi has never shown anything close to what asriel can do. No akame ga kill character has.
By wat on February 27, 2024 at 2:07 am